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Feels like there's 2 camps of Viking fans now
They've Peaked: Blow the whole thing-up (i.e. coaches, GM, new QB)
There's Hope: Double-Down on the assets we have and give this thing a chance to reach potential. Maybe even extend the triangle.
Am I missing one?
There's no way the org. is going to 'blow it up'. A soft re-boot is more likely, with hard decisions coming because of the cap and performance of some vets. Fans are fans and they are as fickle as it gets. The team can certainly improve on things, not trying to say it was all roses and rainbows but blow it all up?? LMAO. The team made it to the divisional round of the playoffs as a wildcard.
If the team shits the bed in 2020, then you'll see it hit the fan.
I don't really see the Vikings as a blow it up team. They have always been good enough to run for the playoffs year after year it seems. With the rare 6-10 and 3-13 season. They have always seems to just re-tool and work with what they have.
Zim and Rick are alright, but to me it's all about QB.
I think Kirk is good, but I'd prefer that the Vikings be aggressive in drafting his replacement. If they can do that without blowing the rest of it up then go for it. Unless you find a Lamar or a Mahomes, then many times a young QB means a big roster churn. I like a lot of the Vikings players so yeah, in a perfect world they'd find a QB in the 3rd round this year, he'd be Russell Wilson, and we'd be off and running for the next 10 years. But I'm trying to be realistic.
For whatever reason, the Vikings under Zimmer seem to chase good years
with worse ones. There are quite a few reasons to think this
phenomena will reoccur next season. So if you believe that, then what's
the point in delaying the inevitable? One more (wasted) year of
mediocrity before the on-the-fencers decide they're comfortable with turnover? No thanks.
I don't think we need to blow it up... like Sticky said a soft "re-boot" is in order given where our cap is sitting heading into 2020. However, I wouldn't commit to Cousins just yet... it seems like the Vikings are in the same situation that Kansas City and Baltimore were in a couple years ago. They were playoff teams with good veteran QBs in place (Alex Smith and Joe Flacco), but they just couldn't get over the hump to be a legit contender. What did they do? They drafted Patrick Mahomes and Lamar Jackson. I think the Vikings should be looking ahead to potentially find a QB that could take over for Kirk if it's more of the same next season... being good, not great.
I think we are in a good spot with Cousins. Last year, he had an OC that clearly has no idea what he's doing (just fired by Jacksonville) and this year he WON a road playoff game vs a team who won 13 games. Expecting the same outcome vs the 49ers just isn't fair as i'll bet, without researching, I can count on one hand the number of QB's who have won back to back road playoff games vs 13 win teams.
Let Kirk play through next year and see where he's at. If it's bad enough then not a lot of teams will be begging to sign him and perhaps we can resign to a more manageable salary. If he has another good year then we can franchise tag or look to extend. I do think this scenario is much different than Baltimore as Joe Flacco forgot how to throw a football past 10 yards, but KC is a fair comparison. The issue with that is this years QB class is rather weak, IMO, after Burrow and Tua. Herbert, Fromm, and Eason all are gambles and should not be our first round pick.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
I don't think we need to blow it up... like Sticky said a soft "re-boot" is in order given where our cap is sitting heading into 2020. However, I wouldn't commit to Cousins just yet... it seems like the Vikings are in the same situation that Kansas City and Baltimore were in a couple years ago. They were playoff teams with good veteran QBs in place (Alex Smith and Joe Flacco), but they just couldn't get over the hump to be a legit contender. What did they do? They drafted Patrick Mahomes and Lamar Jackson. I think the Vikings should be looking ahead to potentially find a QB that could take over for Kirk if it's more of the same next season... being good, not great.
This is what I would like to see as part of their "soft" rebuild. It gives them the opportunity to move on from overpaying a QB who is reliant upon his surrounding cast, and in fact will help with financial freedom to improve the overall roster.
Cousins final contract year will give time to evaluate the young QB and get him some experience.
I fear extending Cousins now will lead to continued inconsistent results. Good against bad teams, bad against good teams.
If the Cousins acquisition proves to be an error in judgement, extending him early would only compound that mistake. No reason to rush into an extension. Although it may happen anyway, simply for cap relief.
Kicking the can down the road for cap relief could prove costly for fans and ownership.
Quote: @Hawkvike25 said:
I think we are in a good spot with Cousins. Last year, he had an OC that clearly has no idea what he's doing (just fired by Jacksonville) and this year he WON a road playoff game vs a team who won 13 games. Expecting the same outcome vs the 49ers just isn't fair as i'll bet, without researching, I can count on one hand the number of QB's who have won back to back road playoff games vs 13 win teams.
Let Kirk play through next year and see where he's at. If it's bad enough then not a lot of teams will be begging to sign him and perhaps we can resign to a more manageable salary. If he has another good year then we can franchise tag or look to extend. I do think this scenario is much different than Baltimore as Joe Flacco forgot how to throw a football past 10 yards, but KC is a fair comparison. The issue with that is this years QB class is rather weak, IMO, after Burrow and Tua. Herbert, Fromm, and Eason all are gambles and should not be our first round pick.
welcome hawk and some good first posts. If Herbert falls to us at 26 I would look like Usain Bolt running to the podium, but my current best evil plan is to trade down to the top of the second, pick up another 3rd or 4th and take Jalen Hurts
With Diggs, Thielen, Cook, Hunter, Barr, Kendricks and likely Harris, we're far too young and talented for a rebuild. I think most successful teams now attempt the rolling rebuild, where you replace age and salary here and there with youth and lace 'em up again and hope to get lucky with a few well placed free agents and draft picks. That will be us. For example, is it crazy to think that whoever we replace Rhodes with will be an upgrade from 2019 Rhodes? Probably not. Same with Reiff. Probably not so Griffen or Joseph, but it is what it is.
The key is the QB. Typically, you rebuild when you change either the FO, the coach, the QB, or all three. None of that is happening in '20. However, despite the fact that Cousins had a good year and you can write a narrative that justifies an extension, I don't think he's going to get it before we see what he does in '20. And I don't think Zimmer will either.
Cousins was under pressure a lot in San Francisco, so this is not just on him, but he also left a lot on the field. Plays where receivers were open and he just failed to pull the trigger. And so is Cousins exactly who his critics said he was? A QB who will always put up good numbers, because he's accurate and smart and well prepared. But a QB who in moments of pressure wilts like a petunia in the heat? I think maybe so. I don't think he has the balls. Maybe I'll change my mind if I see him with a porn star mustache and his shirt open. Maybe I'll change my mind when I see him toking a cigar on the sideline. OK, I'm joking, but only half. Can you win a Super Bowl with him? You bet you can. But he needs more protection than most. Let's get him that protection next year and see what happens.
The answer to the question "do we draft a QB in April" depends on who's available. Obviously. But this may not be the best year to draft a 1st or 2nd round QB. It all but precludes you from taking one in '21 when you might have more clarity, and you might be in a much better position and get a good one. This is a terrible, TERRIBLE year to need a QB because half the NFL is in the same boat...
Either way, I suspect the story of Captain Kirk's time in Minnesota could look a lot like every drive in San Francisco on Saturday: 3 and out.
I'm sure it will not be a blow-it-up, but I think the debate is what shape does the "double down" take. Is it, "We've got a lot invested in our QB and 2 WRs so let's add whatever the offense needs (offensive linemen) to let Cousins overcome his weaknesses and excel so we can win games with our offense"? Because that is more reasonable than if "blow it up" means trying to get the next Mahomes and rebuild the offense to a new style.
But I think the other side being argued may be Zimmer saying that his defense declined, has about 8 significant personnel holes, and that the focus of the team should be to put any and all resources to a defensive rebuild. In other words, a strategy of double-down-to-win-by-defense. That scares me because it will neglect the offense and probably take 2-3 years.
If the team takes the double-down-to-improve-Cousins'-supporting-cast strategy, it means putting up with having a defense that has more gaps and maybe mistakes while counting on our offense to outscore opponents. Can Zimmer accept that?
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