Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
I would bold Watson and maybe Luck. The team hasn't had that type of guy since Fran, outside of Favre's last good year, the only year since Wilf bought the team where they had a legit shot at a title.
I'm not asking for much in light of a franchise failing to find the right guy for 4 decades and funny, failing to even get to a SB since then. Your saying it's hard to achieve greatness so don't bother trying.
Quote: @pattersaur said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ pattersaur said:
@ Havoc1649 said:
With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.
I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams.
We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.
Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.
I dont get the point; Brady and The Bucs lost ZERO to 9 to the Saints at home in 12/21 too...
Vikings get an even average D? I think they're absolutely a contender for a dance spot in post season NFC.
If my uncle had tits he’d be my aunt.
It’s the NFL. Every fanbase can rationalize how close they are. The Vikings are very far away.
They might be but I don't believe it's because of Cousins. Interior OL still sucks and the defense is pathetic. Fix those and I am good with retaining Cousins
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ Riphawkins said:
@ bigbone62 said:
From 2015 which was Cousins first year as the full time starter to 2020, Stafford's last year in Detroit here are their numbers. Pretty obvious why the comparison. Obvious if you are going off of real things and not clichés ole football coaches use that is. Numbers that are bolded are categories they bested the other QB in.
Stafford
Games: 88
W-L: 39-48-1
Comp %:65.6
Passing Yards: 23,395
Rushing Yards: 713
Total Yards: 24,108
QB Rating: 96.2
Passing TDs: 151
Rushing TDs: 3
Total TDs: 154
INT’s: 59
Fumbles Lost: 3
Total Turnovers:62
Turnover Differential: +92
Playoffs: 0-1
Cousins
Games: 95
W-L: 49-44-2
Comp %: 68
Passing Yards: 25,342
Rushing Yards: 665
Total Yards: 26,007
QB Rating: 100.5
Passing TD’s: 172
Rushing TD’S: 16
Total TD’s 188
INT’s: 65
Fumbles Lost: 5
Total Turnovers: 70
Turnover Differential: +118
Playoffs: 1-2
Looks like Cousins is better, and I’m not being a smart ass.
Watched a couple of Rams games this year and Stafford didn’t look great, but that throw near the end of the game in Tampa Bay was a thing of beauty.
Cousins can make that throw.
Kirk can make about any throw the play book requires, but if he's pressured, will he? And if the play breaks down, which so often happens in the NFL, can/will Kirk make that throw/play is where the top QBs separate themselves from Kirk IMO its not what he can do with time, its what he hasn't shown to do when things don't go as planned, thats why I dont like the idea of paying him like those top guys.
Yabbut, some of the QBs who can do exactly what you want can't do other things as well as Kirk can. Tebow, RGIII, Newton, Locker, Manziel, Mayfield...hell even Ponder could escape and make a play, but none of them had Cousins' arm talent. Specifically, his accuracy.
Cousins isn't a perfect QB. But he does so many things incredibly well. And he's the kind of QB you can win a Super Bowl with if he has weapons, moderate protection, league average defense and a coach who doesn't butt-punt every close game he's in.
If you're waiting for a mobile, elusive QB who can also do what Kirk does, you're going to be waiting a very very long time. I will say, however, the NFL seems to be getting a little better at identifying who those QBs are--probably analytics. So maybe we'll get lucky.
I'm not even talking about a great scrambling qb, I'm talking about a guy that can move away from pressure to buy an extra tick or two and allow his receivers to work back to him. There have been plenty of QBs that had good enough arm talent that didn't look like a potted plant in the pocket.
Quote: @bigbone62 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ bigbone62 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ purplefaithful said:
I suspect when they extend KC, his $ will be less than Brady, Mahomes, Allen or Rogers...
But he deserves to be in the next tier.
Brady has been playing for under 29 million...I wish we could get Kirk to see the benefit of that for him.
I'm sure Cousins and every player wished they were married to a supermodel worth $400 million. Alas just Brady, so the comparison is brutal. Easy to take way less when your wife pulls tens of millions more in annual salary than you.
kirk has made 160 million in his career.... does it really fucking matter at that point? if this is about the money for kirk at this point... I think that would make the decision even that much easier to move on from him.
And there it is, the painfully transparent jealous fan whining about "how much is enough" post. He's paid exactly what the market has dictated he be paid. If you arent getting paid what your profession dictates, you may want to take a look at the guy representing you at pay bump time.
If you are getting paid what you're worth. I sure hope you don't have know it alls who've never done your job obsessing about you online. Simply because you're better off financially and can do something they never could.
Simply because you or I will never sniff that amount of money doesn't mean he, or any athlete doesnt deserve every penny they make. Because NCAAF and NFL chew these guys up and spit them out to make insane profits.
You have absolutely no clue what these guys give up. Family, physical and mental health, substance abuse issues among much more. All a direct result of playing a game for your entertainment. I'm sure if you could "play the game for free" you would. Until you've actually played and realize it's not the fantasyland version Joe Sixpack thinks it is.
Lol, there it is, the starbucks shrink has busted me. Give me a fucking break. If I was really worked up over people getting over paid I wouldn't be a fan of pro sports and certainly wouldn't have spent the many thousands I have over my lifetime to follow my teams.
I could care less what he gets paid, except its a capped league and the more they over pay any 1 player, the less they have to fix other positions.... so if he really wants to say he's here to help the team win, then he will accept an offer that will do just that, ( like Brady) if not then he is just a mercenary doing it for the money and will not ever be the team guy we need at the QB position.
But keep working on the shrink shit its amusing if nothing else.
Quote: @comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
I would bold Watson and maybe Luck. The team hasn't had that type of guy since Fran, outside of Favre's last good year, the only year since Wilf bought the team where they had a legit shot at a title.
I'm not asking for much in light of a franchise failing to find the right guy for 4 decades and funny, failing to even get to a SB since then. Your saying it's hard to achieve greatness so don't bother trying.
No, I'm saying it's hard to find greatness in the draft. But you can go buy it.
You can't put Luck or Watson in bold. Neither one is even a starter. Not saying they weren't a good draft pick. Just that they aren't currently meeting your criteria. Or helping their teams. There are a hundred reasons QBs fail. Injury, off-field issues are just two of them. But it does (or should) make you appreciate character and durability in a veteran if you can find it.
See how the first 2/3 of the list is unbolded? Only recently did we start to see some success. But it makes you wonder: is the NFL getting better at identifying talent? Or have those picks just not had enough time to fuck up yet?
Herbert, Burrow, Allen and Murray look good now, but Bradford, RGIII, and Cam Newton were all rookies of the year. Teams who drafted Luck, Winston, Mariota, Wentz, Goff, Trubisky, and Bridgewater thought they hit paydirt too.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ bigbone62 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ bigbone62 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ purplefaithful said:
I suspect when they extend KC, his $ will be less than Brady, Mahomes, Allen or Rogers...
But he deserves to be in the next tier.
Brady has been playing for under 29 million...I wish we could get Kirk to see the benefit of that for him.
I'm sure Cousins and every player wished they were married to a supermodel worth $400 million. Alas just Brady, so the comparison is brutal. Easy to take way less when your wife pulls tens of millions more in annual salary than you.
kirk has made 160 million in his career.... does it really fucking matter at that point? if this is about the money for kirk at this point... I think that would make the decision even that much easier to move on from him.
And there it is, the painfully transparent jealous fan whining about "how much is enough" post. He's paid exactly what the market has dictated he be paid. If you arent getting paid what your profession dictates, you may want to take a look at the guy representing you at pay bump time.
If you are getting paid what you're worth. I sure hope you don't have know it alls who've never done your job obsessing about you online. Simply because you're better off financially and can do something they never could.
Simply because you or I will never sniff that amount of money doesn't mean he, or any athlete doesnt deserve every penny they make. Because NCAAF and NFL chew these guys up and spit them out to make insane profits.
You have absolutely no clue what these guys give up. Family, physical and mental health, substance abuse issues among much more. All a direct result of playing a game for your entertainment. I'm sure if you could "play the game for free" you would. Until you've actually played and realize it's not the fantasyland version Joe Sixpack thinks it is.
I said as much last week. Nothing screams tone deaf more than the 'how much money is enough' stuff from fans. Nonsensical.
Then why did Brady play for less then? Does he care less about his body? I have to imagine that laying next to a Brazilian supermodel every night likely does his mental health pretty good, but maybe its not just about the contract for him. He still has made a shit ton of money as has Kirk, the difference is the success and the people they could afford to put around Brady. Kirk doesn't have to play for peanuts, but an extra 10 million in cap space is the difference between Mason Cole as your OG and Brandon Sherff.
If KC is concerned about the physical tolls that this game can cause, he could be doing something about it.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
You know who did it right? The Rams when they brought in Stafford. The Bucs when they brought in Brady. The Broncos when they brought in Manning. If the Vikings are smart they will hand the keys to KOC's offense to Cousins and take their shot at a QB in next year's draft.
#1 Sam Bradford QB Oklahoma St. Louis Rams
#25 Tim Tebow QB Florida Denver Broncos
#1 Cam Newton QB Auburn Carolina Panthers
#8 Jake Locker QB Washington Tennessee Titans
#10 Blaine Gabbert QB Missouri Jacksonville Jaguars
#12 Christian Ponder QB Florida State Minnesota Vikings
#1 Andrew Luck QB Stanford Indianapolis Colts
#2 Robert Griffin QB Baylor Washington Redskins
#8 Ryan Tannehill QB Texas A&M Miami Dolphins
#22 Brandon Weeden QB Oklahoma State Cleveland Browns
#16 EJ Manuel QB Florida State Buffalo Bills
#3 Blake Bortles QB Central Florida Jacksonville Jaguars
#22 Johnny Manziel QB Texas A&M Cleveland Browns
#32 Teddy Bridgewater QB Louisville Minnesota Vikings
#1 Jameis Winston QB Florida State Tampa Bay Buccaneers
#2 Marcus Mariota QB Oregon Tennessee Titans
#1 Jared Goff QB California Los Angeles Rams
#2 Carson Wentz QB North Dakota State Philadelphia Eagles
#26 Paxton Lynch QB Memphis Denver Broncos
#2 Mitchell Trubisky QB North Carolina Chicago Bears
#10 Patrick Mahomes QB Texas Tech Kansas City Chiefs
#12 Deshaun Watson QB Clemson Houston Texans
#1 Baker Mayfield QB Oklahoma Cleveland Browns
#3 Sam Darnold QB USC New York Jets
#7 Josh Allen QB Wyoming Buffalo Bills
#10 Josh Rosen QB UCLA Arizona Cardinals
#32 Lamar Jackson QB Louisville Baltimore Ravens
#1 Kyler Murray QB Oklahoma Arizona Cardinals
#6 Daniel Jones QB Duke New York Giants
#15 Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State Washington Redskins
#1 Joe Burrow QB LSU Benglas
#5 Tua Tagovailoa QB Alabama Miami Dolphins
#6 Justin Herbert QB Oregon LA Chargers
#26 Jordan Love QB Utah St. Green Bay Packers
#1 Trevor Lawrence QB Clemson Jax Jags
#2 Zach Wilson QB BYU NY Jets
#3 Trey Lance QB ND State 49ers
#11 Justin Fields QB OSU Bears
#15 Mac Jones QB Alabama Patriots
The thing that most of these teams have in common is that they built a championship caliber team, then they brought in their franchise QB. The Rams traded for Stafford. The Bucs signed Brady. KC & Buffalo drafted theirs. We're not there yet.
The more that I think about it if the team wants to keep Kirk short term, they should do so by adding one or two void years to his current contract. I have no issue with paying him $35M annually. But, the thought of going up to $40M or more which is what the market will dictate makes me cringe & I say that realizing that the Cap is going to take a big jump in 2023.
Quote: @Knucklehead said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
You know who did it right? The Rams when they brought in Stafford. The Bucs when they brought in Brady. The Broncos when they brought in Manning. If the Vikings are smart they will hand the keys to KOC's offense to Cousins and take their shot at a QB in next year's draft.
#1 Sam Bradford QB Oklahoma St. Louis Rams
#25 Tim Tebow QB Florida Denver Broncos
#1 Cam Newton QB Auburn Carolina Panthers
#8 Jake Locker QB Washington Tennessee Titans
#10 Blaine Gabbert QB Missouri Jacksonville Jaguars
#12 Christian Ponder QB Florida State Minnesota Vikings
#1 Andrew Luck QB Stanford Indianapolis Colts
#2 Robert Griffin QB Baylor Washington Redskins
#8 Ryan Tannehill QB Texas A&M Miami Dolphins
#22 Brandon Weeden QB Oklahoma State Cleveland Browns
#16 EJ Manuel QB Florida State Buffalo Bills
#3 Blake Bortles QB Central Florida Jacksonville Jaguars
#22 Johnny Manziel QB Texas A&M Cleveland Browns
#32 Teddy Bridgewater QB Louisville Minnesota Vikings
#1 Jameis Winston QB Florida State Tampa Bay Buccaneers
#2 Marcus Mariota QB Oregon Tennessee Titans
#1 Jared Goff QB California Los Angeles Rams
#2 Carson Wentz QB North Dakota State Philadelphia Eagles
#26 Paxton Lynch QB Memphis Denver Broncos
#2 Mitchell Trubisky QB North Carolina Chicago Bears
#10 Patrick Mahomes QB Texas Tech Kansas City Chiefs
#12 Deshaun Watson QB Clemson Houston Texans
#1 Baker Mayfield QB Oklahoma Cleveland Browns
#3 Sam Darnold QB USC New York Jets
#7 Josh Allen QB Wyoming Buffalo Bills
#10 Josh Rosen QB UCLA Arizona Cardinals
#32 Lamar Jackson QB Louisville Baltimore Ravens
#1 Kyler Murray QB Oklahoma Arizona Cardinals
#6 Daniel Jones QB Duke New York Giants
#15 Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State Washington Redskins
#1 Joe Burrow QB LSU Benglas
#5 Tua Tagovailoa QB Alabama Miami Dolphins
#6 Justin Herbert QB Oregon LA Chargers
#26 Jordan Love QB Utah St. Green Bay Packers
#1 Trevor Lawrence QB Clemson Jax Jags
#2 Zach Wilson QB BYU NY Jets
#3 Trey Lance QB ND State 49ers
#11 Justin Fields QB OSU Bears
#15 Mac Jones QB Alabama Patriots
The thing that most of these teams have in common is that they built a championship caliber team, then they brought in their franchise QB. The Rams traded for Stafford. The Bucs signed Brady. KC & Buffalo drafted theirs. We're not there yet.
The more that I think about it if the team wants to keep Kirk short term, they should do so by adding one or two void years to his current contract. I have no issue with paying him $35M annually. But, the thought of going up to $40M or more which is what the market will dictate makes me cringe & I say that realizing that the Cap is going to take a big jump in 2023.
Its a percentages game, and every player/position is going to want a bigger slice of that new larger cap number. Imo KC is to large a % now and that number needs to go down to build that competitive roster around him to fix those issues that his supporters keep bringing up as excuses for why he doesn't succeed here.
Him as well as a few others need to take hair cuts or be replaced with younger or cheaper options.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
I would bold Watson and maybe Luck. The team hasn't had that type of guy since Fran, outside of Favre's last good year, the only year since Wilf bought the team where they had a legit shot at a title.
I'm not asking for much in light of a franchise failing to find the right guy for 4 decades and funny, failing to even get to a SB since then. Your saying it's hard to achieve greatness so don't bother trying.
No, I'm saying it's hard to find greatness in the draft. But you can go buy it.
You can't put Luck or Watson in bold. Neither one is even a starter. Not saying they weren't a good draft pick. Just that they aren't currently meeting your criteria. Or helping their teams. There are a hundred reasons QBs fail. Injury, off-field issues are just two of them. But it does (or should) make you appreciate character and durability in a veteran if you can find it.
See how the first 2/3 of the list is unbolded? Only recently did we start to see some success. But it makes you wonder: is the NFL getting better at identifying talent? Or have those picks just not had enough time to fuck up yet?
Herbert, Burrow, Allen and Murray look good now, but Bradford, RGIII, and Cam Newton were all rookies of the year. Teams who drafted Luck, Winston, Mariota, Wentz, Goff, Trubisky, and Bridgewater thought they hit paydirt too.
Kirk is not who I would gamble my new career on if I were KAM/KOC. Just my gambler's opinion...
Quote: @comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
I don't want Matt Stafford any more than I want Kirk. I didn't want Trent Dilfer after he won a ring with the Ravens. I want the franchise to find a real franchise qb, the kind of guy who makes you relevant every year, not the guy who if you put the perfect team around him and have a bunch of luck he might win it once in his career.
Hey, you're not asking for much are ya? LOL
Here are all the QBs taken in the 1st round since 2010. There's 39 QBs here. I've bolded the ones I think pass your test. There are five of them. And I'm being nice with a couple, because only 1 of the 39 has won a Super Bowl. So 5 outta 39. That's 12%. We have a 12% chance of finding that guy in the draft. Even in the 1st round. And MOST of these guys are top 10 picks. We likely won't be picking that high.
I would bold Watson and maybe Luck. The team hasn't had that type of guy since Fran, outside of Favre's last good year, the only year since Wilf bought the team where they had a legit shot at a title.
I'm not asking for much in light of a franchise failing to find the right guy for 4 decades and funny, failing to even get to a SB since then. Your saying it's hard to achieve greatness so don't bother trying.
No, I'm saying it's hard to find greatness in the draft. But you can go buy it.
You can't put Luck or Watson in bold. Neither one is even a starter. Not saying they weren't a good draft pick. Just that they aren't currently meeting your criteria. Or helping their teams. There are a hundred reasons QBs fail. Injury, off-field issues are just two of them. But it does (or should) make you appreciate character and durability in a veteran if you can find it.
See how the first 2/3 of the list is unbolded? Only recently did we start to see some success. But it makes you wonder: is the NFL getting better at identifying talent? Or have those picks just not had enough time to fuck up yet?
Herbert, Burrow, Allen and Murray look good now, but Bradford, RGIII, and Cam Newton were all rookies of the year. Teams who drafted Luck, Winston, Mariota, Wentz, Goff, Trubisky, and Bridgewater thought they hit paydirt too.
Kirk is not who I would gamble my new career on if I were KAM/KOC. Just my gambler's opinion...
Who would you go after?
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