Where is the President?

[Guest]

I have been going around on this issue, listening to all the talking head generals and ambassadors and I come away with two things.
1) We pursued years of trying to set up a government we would like, and that didn't work.  Democracy and representative government isn't automatically embraced and natural in all parts of the world.  Heard more than expert lament the fact that the Taliban may be the natural centralized leadership model in the region.  It appears fealty to local warlords is the other most likely form of non-occupational organization that can survive.
2) The Afghan government we were "helping" to establish was corrupt and a fraud.  The security forces we had supplied and organized was abandoned by their own government, once we set a date for pull out there was not going to be any central authority or COC.  I suppose we could have pulled all the tech. and weapons, but imagine the optics of leaving in that manner.

The optics of this ending are bad, but at least the Taliban are living up to their end of the agreement, they are not stopping or attacking Americans yet.  The withdrawal agreement didn't even include the Afghan government, they were expected to negotiate their own future , instead they beat-feat so fast there was nothing in-place when we left.

Hope we can learn a lesson about nation building, but I doubt it.

[Guest]

@Zanary said:
The U.N. is a s**tshow, but so's our duopoly.  Failure was inevitable.

Joe "you ain't Black" Biden is an embarrassment, and he's barely getting started.  Throw in a VP that may actually be LESS suited for the job than Sarah Palin was/is, and it's going to be like the Quayle nightmare actually happened.

Afghanistan has known little but chaos and hardship for longer than our lives, and somehow always returns to it.

Afghanistan is the Poland of the Middle East. 

Tragic and Sad.

[Guest]

I keep thinking about benghazi,  how do we fuck these things up so badly considering the amount of resources we put into the military and intelligence?

[Guest]

@BigAl99 said:

I have been going around on this issue, listening to all the talking head generals and ambassadors and I come away with two things.
1) We pursued years of trying to set up a government we would like, and that didn't work.  Democracy and representative government isn't automatically embraced and natural in all parts of the world.  Heard more than expert lament the fact that the Taliban may be the natural centralized leadership model in the region.  It appears fealty to local warlords is the other most likely form of non-occupational organization that can survive.
2) The Afghan government we were "helping" to establish was corrupt and a fraud.  The security forces we had supplied and organized was abandoned by their own government, once we set a date for pull out there was not going to be any central authority or COC.  I suppose we could have pulled all the tech. and weapons, but imagine the optics of leaving in that manner.

The optics of this ending are bad, but at least the Taliban are living up to their end of the agreement, they are not stopping or attacking Americans yet.  The withdrawal agreement didn't even include the Afghan government, they were expected to negotiate their own future , instead they beat-feat so fast there was nothing in-place when we left.

Hope we can learn a lesson about nation building, but I doubt it.

That would be hilarious if it weren't so tragically false.  Find a new source for your talking points.

And the optics are bad?  No, the optics aren't important.  The lives of people are important.  But our govt hasn't cared about people for a long time.  At least you acknowledge the issue with nation building.  

[Guest]

@greediron said:

@BigAl99 said:

I have been going around on this issue, listening to all the talking head generals and ambassadors and I come away with two things.
1) We pursued years of trying to set up a government we would like, and that didn't work.  Democracy and representative government isn't automatically embraced and natural in all parts of the world.  Heard more than expert lament the fact that the Taliban may be the natural centralized leadership model in the region.  It appears fealty to local warlords is the other most likely form of non-occupational organization that can survive.
2) The Afghan government we were "helping" to establish was corrupt and a fraud.  The security forces we had supplied and organized was abandoned by their own government, once we set a date for pull out there was not going to be any central authority or COC.  I suppose we could have pulled all the tech. and weapons, but imagine the optics of leaving in that manner.

The optics of this ending are bad, but at least the Taliban are living up to their end of the agreement, they are not stopping or attacking Americans yet.  The withdrawal agreement didn't even include the Afghan government, they were expected to negotiate their own future , instead they beat-feat so fast there was nothing in-place when we left.

Hope we can learn a lesson about nation building, but I doubt it.

That would be hilarious if it weren't so tragically false.  Find a new source for your talking points.

And the optics are bad?  No, the optics aren't important.  The lives of people are important.  But our govt hasn't cared about people for a long time.  At least you acknowledge the issue with nation building.  

Right, what part of the Pompeo' negotiated withdrawal agreement are they not following.  It wasn't a peace treaty for Afghanistan, it was for safe withdrawal of US personnel and associates.Love your consistent concern for the lives of people, feel the same way about South Americans. 

[Guest]

She must be getting all that misinformation off facebook. 


https://twitter.com/capeandcowell/status...9261105154

[Guest]

@BigAl99 said:

@greediron said:

@BigAl99 said:

I have been going around on this issue, listening to all the talking head generals and ambassadors and I come away with two things.
1) We pursued years of trying to set up a government we would like, and that didn't work.  Democracy and representative government isn't automatically embraced and natural in all parts of the world.  Heard more than expert lament the fact that the Taliban may be the natural centralized leadership model in the region.  It appears fealty to local warlords is the other most likely form of non-occupational organization that can survive.
2) The Afghan government we were "helping" to establish was corrupt and a fraud.  The security forces we had supplied and organized was abandoned by their own government, once we set a date for pull out there was not going to be any central authority or COC.  I suppose we could have pulled all the tech. and weapons, but imagine the optics of leaving in that manner.

The optics of this ending are bad, but at least the Taliban are living up to their end of the agreement, they are not stopping or attacking Americans yet.  The withdrawal agreement didn't even include the Afghan government, they were expected to negotiate their own future , instead they beat-feat so fast there was nothing in-place when we left.

Hope we can learn a lesson about nation building, but I doubt it.

That would be hilarious if it weren't so tragically false.  Find a new source for your talking points.

And the optics are bad?  No, the optics aren't important.  The lives of people are important.  But our govt hasn't cared about people for a long time.  At least you acknowledge the issue with nation building.  

Right, what part of the Pompeo' negotiated withdrawal agreement are they not following.  It wasn't a peace treaty for Afghanistan, it was for safe withdrawal of US personnel and associates.Love your consistent concern for the lives of people, feel the same way about South Americans. 

Not sure what the agreement sez, but pretty sure this ain't it chief.  As for your hyperbole, what about the Cubans?  Do they deserve our 'concern'?

 https://twitter.com/ianbremmer/status/14...7709273096

[Guest]

As I said, find new sources for your talking points.  Biden clearly isn't the most trusted source for news.

[Guest]

@greediron said:
As I said, find new sources for your talking points.  Biden clearly isn't the most trusted source for news.

no,  but I bet he knows where to get the best ice cream.

[Guest]

@greediron said:
As I said, find new sources for your talking points.  Biden clearly isn't the most trusted source for news.

Not real hard to find and really an artistic peace of work.