Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
And with the trade of Carson Wentz, there will now not be a single QB drafted in the first round from 2009-2016 that is still with his original team.
0 out of 22 total.
This. All day, this. This should be posted in every draft room and at the top of every message board to remind people what a crapshoot the draft is, every time they assume Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance or Jones is going to be the answer to all their prayers.
And if you think it improved after 2016, OK, it did...a little. But those years also gave us Trubisky, Darnold, Rosen, Daniel Jones, Haskins, and Tua...
I think this fact is why more and more teams are choosing to go the veteran trade or free agent route rather than take a seat at the craps table. It's also why teams who already have a top 10 QB aren't very eager to cash that in for this year's Jameis Mariota or Carson Goff or Johnny Bortles.
This is such a stupid incomplete cherry picked stat. Here is the list of QBs in that list ...
Stafford - Just got traded for a starting QB and two 1st round picksSanchez - Bust out of the league and went to a bad situationFreeman - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBradford - Oft injured bust but there was one GM stupid enough to give up a 1st and a 4th for himTebow - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonNewton - Started last yearLocker - Bust out of the leagueGabbert - Bust and now a backupPonder - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundLuck - RetiredTannehill - Busted with Dolphins and now a solid starterWeeden - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundManuel - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBortles - Bust and now a backupManziel - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonBridgewater - Injured but now a starterWinston - Bust in Tampa, backup that could become a starterMariota - Bust in Tennessee, backup that could become a starterGoff - Rams gave up but Detroit wanted himWentz - Just traded to start for the ColtsLynch - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st round
I'm confused. You can't possibly be using this list to argue FOR the quality of 1st round QBs in those years...can you?
Think about it. 2009-2016. That means QBs in years 5 thru 12--the heart of what should be their primes. And yet none of them has won a Super Bowl, none are with their original teams, and a good portion are out of the league. And if you think this is restricted to just 2009-2016, go ahead and look up any other 7 year stretch.
When you use a 1st round pick on a QB, it's kind of a big deal. Most teams will do it only once or twice in 30, 40 years. It sort of represents starting over. Teams who do it expect that QB to become their long-term starter. But reality tells a different story.
Based on who won the Super Bowl, stats like 0-22 above, it's no wonder that more and more teams are looking for veterans instead of a seat at the craps table. Actually, we should probably stopping using "craps" as a metaphor for the draft. Your odds of hitting at a craps table are clearly much higher than they are for hitting on a QB in the draft.
Not all of these QBs are busts. Stafford wasn't. Luck wasn't. But there are 22 QBs here. Do the math. Take it out of context if you have to. How many times do you typically bang your head against the wall before looking for a way around? 23 times?
Vikings have a top 10 QB, top 5 in several categories. He's 32, loves Minnesota, and he's never hurt. He's not perfect, but instead of continuing to develop his offensive line, you want to dump him for a seat at the 0 fer 22 table? No. Fuck no.
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
I'm just ranting a bit. Somebody must have swapped out my beer for bitter beer.
I know the Vikings are rolling with Cousins. That's fine.
I have zero confidence that he will deliver in the clutch against really good teams.
He needs everything around him to be perfect to do his best.
A bit? Geez us, I'd hate to see an all out bitchfest.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
I'm just ranting a bit. Somebody must have swapped out my beer for bitter beer.
I know the Vikings are rolling with Cousins. That's fine.
I have zero confidence that he will deliver in the clutch against really good teams.
He needs everything around him to be perfect to do his best.
A bit? Geez us, I'd hate to see an all out bitchfest.
![[Image: bitchfest.gif?w=300]](http://hdfloyd73.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/bitchfest.gif?w=300)
Ahh another thread that has turned into a Cousins bashing, wouldn't have guessed that. Might as well package Cousins, Dalvin, Irv Smith, and two first rounders for Deshaun. Cant lose situation....did I do that right? Go find another team to "root for"
Quote: @Hawkvike25 said:
Ahh another thread that has turned into a Cousins bashing, wouldn't have guessed that. Might as well package Cousins, Dalvin, Irv Smith, and two first rounders for Deshaun. Cant lose situation....did I do that right? Go find another team to "root for"
Perfect.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
I'm just ranting a bit. Somebody must have swapped out my beer for bitter beer.
I know the Vikings are rolling with Cousins. That's fine.
I have zero confidence that he will deliver in the clutch against really good teams.
He needs everything around him to be perfect to do his best.
A bit? Geez us, I'd hate to see an all out bitchfest.
Nah dude. Cant get me like that. I am man enough to own up to stuff.
I use to post at the Star Tribune way back in the day, then over to purplethoughts. That is where I found out about this site.
It is a bit of a members only club here though.
I could be wrong, but as a frequent reader and infrequent poster, it seem like that if you have an opinion that does not conform to the majority then there is a group of herd thinkers that attempt to discourage the opinion.
At the end of the day, Cousins has taken this team to the playoffs 1 time in 3 years.
He started off last season horribly right when the defense needed the offense to help them out the most.
His contract is a detriment to the team due to the lower than expected salary cap.
That number MIGHT reach $200M in 2022.
If it does, he still counts 22.5% against the cap.
Extending him beyond 2022 is not something I am a fan of. This is where the folks here will swear that he can continue well into his late 30's.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
And with the trade of Carson Wentz, there will now not be a single QB drafted in the first round from 2009-2016 that is still with his original team.
0 out of 22 total.
This. All day, this. This should be posted in every draft room and at the top of every message board to remind people what a crapshoot the draft is, every time they assume Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance or Jones is going to be the answer to all their prayers.
And if you think it improved after 2016, OK, it did...a little. But those years also gave us Trubisky, Darnold, Rosen, Daniel Jones, Haskins, and Tua...
I think this fact is why more and more teams are choosing to go the veteran trade or free agent route rather than take a seat at the craps table. It's also why teams who already have a top 10 QB aren't very eager to cash that in for this year's Jameis Mariota or Carson Goff or Johnny Bortles.
This is such a stupid incomplete cherry picked stat. Here is the list of QBs in that list ...
Stafford - Just got traded for a starting QB and two 1st round picksSanchez - Bust out of the league and went to a bad situationFreeman - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBradford - Oft injured bust but there was one GM stupid enough to give up a 1st and a 4th for himTebow - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonNewton - Started last yearLocker - Bust out of the leagueGabbert - Bust and now a backupPonder - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundLuck - RetiredTannehill - Busted with Dolphins and now a solid starterWeeden - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundManuel - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBortles - Bust and now a backupManziel - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonBridgewater - Injured but now a starterWinston - Bust in Tampa, backup that could become a starterMariota - Bust in Tennessee, backup that could become a starterGoff - Rams gave up but Detroit wanted himWentz - Just traded to start for the ColtsLynch - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st round
I'm confused. You can't possibly be using this list to argue FOR the quality of 1st round QBs in those years...can you?
Think about it. 2009-2016. That means QBs in years 5 thru 12--the heart of what should be their primes. And yet none of them has won a Super Bowl, none are with their original teams, and a good portion are out of the league. And if you think this is restricted to just 2009-2016, go ahead and look up any other 7 year stretch.
When you use a 1st round pick on a QB, it's kind of a big deal. Most teams will do it only once or twice in 30, 40 years. It sort of represents starting over. Teams who do it expect that QB to become their long-term starter. But reality tells a different story.
Based on who won the Super Bowl, stats like 0-22 above, it's no wonder that more and more teams are looking for veterans instead of a seat at the craps table. Actually, we should probably stopping using "craps" as a metaphor for the draft. Your odds of hitting at a craps table are clearly much higher than they are for hitting on a QB in the draft.
Not all of these QBs are busts. Stafford wasn't. Luck wasn't. But there are 22 QBs here. Do the math. Take it out of context if you have to. How many times do you typically bang your head against the wall before looking for a way around? 23 times?
Vikings have a top 10 QB, top 5 in several categories. He's 32, loves Minnesota, and he's never hurt. He's not perfect, but instead of continuing to develop his offensive line, you want to dump him for a seat at the 0 fer 22 table? No. Fuck no.
What is the point of the stat? So what the QBs are no longer with their current team or in the league. Several shouldn't have been drafted in the 1st round anyway.
Others had decent careers and several will start this year. Don't matter if it is with the team that drafted them.
It is a poor excuse for not drafting a QB early.
I notice you did not mention Andy Reid trading up to get Mahomes who was NOT the top ranked QB in 2017.
Like I said, he already had a 33 year Alex Smith who is similar to Cousins.
Why didn't Reid realize what this stat supposedly should tell GMs?
@ MarkSP18 naw, just tired of your non-stop bitching. Plenty of other boards for that.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
And with the trade of Carson Wentz, there will now not be a single QB drafted in the first round from 2009-2016 that is still with his original team.
0 out of 22 total.
This. All day, this. This should be posted in every draft room and at the top of every message board to remind people what a crapshoot the draft is, every time they assume Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance or Jones is going to be the answer to all their prayers.
And if you think it improved after 2016, OK, it did...a little. But those years also gave us Trubisky, Darnold, Rosen, Daniel Jones, Haskins, and Tua...
I think this fact is why more and more teams are choosing to go the veteran trade or free agent route rather than take a seat at the craps table. It's also why teams who already have a top 10 QB aren't very eager to cash that in for this year's Jameis Mariota or Carson Goff or Johnny Bortles.
This is such a stupid incomplete cherry picked stat. Here is the list of QBs in that list ...
Stafford - Just got traded for a starting QB and two 1st round picksSanchez - Bust out of the league and went to a bad situationFreeman - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBradford - Oft injured bust but there was one GM stupid enough to give up a 1st and a 4th for himTebow - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonNewton - Started last yearLocker - Bust out of the leagueGabbert - Bust and now a backupPonder - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundLuck - RetiredTannehill - Busted with Dolphins and now a solid starterWeeden - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundManuel - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st roundBortles - Bust and now a backupManziel - Bust out of the league and never given the first team reps during offseasonBridgewater - Injured but now a starterWinston - Bust in Tampa, backup that could become a starterMariota - Bust in Tennessee, backup that could become a starterGoff - Rams gave up but Detroit wanted himWentz - Just traded to start for the ColtsLynch - Bust never should have been drafted in the 1st round
I'm confused. You can't possibly be using this list to argue FOR the quality of 1st round QBs in those years...can you?
Think about it. 2009-2016. That means QBs in years 5 thru 12--the heart of what should be their primes. And yet none of them has won a Super Bowl, none are with their original teams, and a good portion are out of the league. And if you think this is restricted to just 2009-2016, go ahead and look up any other 7 year stretch.
When you use a 1st round pick on a QB, it's kind of a big deal. Most teams will do it only once or twice in 30, 40 years. It sort of represents starting over. Teams who do it expect that QB to become their long-term starter. But reality tells a different story.
Based on who won the Super Bowl, stats like 0-22 above, it's no wonder that more and more teams are looking for veterans instead of a seat at the craps table. Actually, we should probably stopping using "craps" as a metaphor for the draft. Your odds of hitting at a craps table are clearly much higher than they are for hitting on a QB in the draft.
Not all of these QBs are busts. Stafford wasn't. Luck wasn't. But there are 22 QBs here. Do the math. Take it out of context if you have to. How many times do you typically bang your head against the wall before looking for a way around? 23 times?
Vikings have a top 10 QB, top 5 in several categories. He's 32, loves Minnesota, and he's never hurt. He's not perfect, but instead of continuing to develop his offensive line, you want to dump him for a seat at the 0 fer 22 table? No. Fuck no.
I think the story isn't that teams strongly want veteran QBs over drafted QBs it's that they don't want to invest long term in midlevel QBs that won't be able to get them over the hump, prevent them from drafting their next option, and tank their cap. I think you'll see teams pick up these guys on contracts that are easy to escape from should an Alex Smith to Mahomes transition become available to them.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
@MarkSP18 naw, just tired of your non-stop bitching. Plenty of other boards for that.
There you go. My point is made. If you do not conform or have a not so rosy opinion then you are not welcome.
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