Quote: @Magnus10 said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
Sorry I just cant agree with the statement about having 2 franchise QBs in Sam and Teddy. Sam has the arm talent to be a franchise QB and the first Saints game showed all of his capabilities. But the injuries and being on his third team kind of undermine that. At least Sam has shown he has the capability to be a franchise QB, if he can stay healthy, have a pretty clean pocket, and have some good weapons at his disposal.
Teddy just has not shown he is a franchise QB yet. He MIGHT evolve/improve and eventually get there, but there is also is a good chance he might not. Add in the knee injury and I just can't put my trust in him as THE guy.
Over the last two seasons we have had capable to good, and sometimes great, QB play from Bradford and Keenum. I think we are all in for a shock if we go all in on Teddy and find him to be about the same QB he was in 2015. He tends to hold the ball too long, check down regularly, and is not good on the deep ball. I have seen enough games where we don't break 100 yards passing. The reality is Teddy can not make the majority of the intermediate-deep throws that Sam made against the Saints, and has never produced the results we saw from Keenum this season.
I think we need to take a long look at Cousins, and if that does not work out maybe bring Case back on a shorter term contract and see if Teddy can back him up if his contract tolls. I love Sams ability to throw the ball, but given DeFillipo's comments about wanting more mobility from his QBs I am not sure if he sees a good fit there.
Absolutely fantastic post, welcome to the board!
Quote: @Magnus10 said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
Sorry I just cant agree with the statement about having 2 franchise QBs in Sam and Teddy. Sam has the arm talent to be a franchise QB and the first Saints game showed all of his capabilities. But the injuries and being on his third team kind of undermine that. At least Sam has shown he has the capability to be a franchise QB, if he can stay healthy, have a pretty clean pocket, and have some good weapons at his disposal.
Teddy just has not shown he is a franchise QB yet. He MIGHT evolve/improve and eventually get there, but there is also is a good chance he might not. Add in the knee injury and I just can't put my trust in him as THE guy.
Over the last two seasons we have had capable to good, and sometimes great, QB play from Bradford and Keenum. I think we are all in for a shock if we go all in on Teddy and find him to be about the same QB he was in 2015. He tends to hold the ball too long, check down regularly, and is not good on the deep ball. I have seen enough games where we don't break 100 yards passing. The reality is Teddy can not make the majority of the intermediate-deep throws that Sam made against the Saints, and has never produced the results we saw from Keenum this season.
I think we need to take a long look at Cousins, and if that does not work out maybe bring Case back on a shorter term contract and see if Teddy can back him up if his contract tolls. I love Sams ability to throw the ball, but given DeFillipo's comments about wanting more mobility from his QBs I am not sure if he sees a good fit there.
If Teddy tolls you might as well save the cap space and bring in a cheaper option as back up, or a better option for competition. Teddy would beat Case out for the job and you would have 20+ million stuck into a non producing spot that could better be spent on improving an already weak spot like OG or 3T, or several other areas instead of relying on the draft to provide. If you are hell bent on spending 20+ on a QB might as well spend a few million more and get cousins at that point, who comes with his own question marks, but is more likely to improve the position than Case is IMO.
health in my opionion tosses Teddy out. Id rather risk it on Sam knowing if he stays healthy like 2 yrs ago hes the best option. if you want a more sure thing sign cousins or case.
Quote: @AGRforever said:
health in my opionion tosses Teddy out. Id rather risk it on Sam knowing if he stays healthy like 2 yrs ago hes the best option. if you want a more sure thing sign cousins or case.
I thought I read at some point Sam's knee is feeling ok and it was debunked he was bone on bone? But based on DeFillipo's comments on mobility, I wonder about Sam. Maybe they'll decide to go with him being less mobile because of his arm and accuracy?
Quote: @Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
You are totally misunderstanding me - or you are the one advocating a bias about our GM. I said nothing about whether Bradford or Bridgewater (or Keenum or Cousins for that matter) are "franchise QBs". OTOH, you said that both Bradford and Bridgewater are franchise quarterbacks simply because they are both former first-rounders.
To be explicit, my point was: a team should not use draft position to determine a veteran player's current quality. Where they were initially drafted, or even how much we spent in draft picks to acquire a player, is just being hung up on evaluations regarding their college performance - not to mention other factors like combine workouts, pro days, Wonderlic tests, etc. I like the draft but it makes me laugh how announcers list what round players were drafted in, even a decade after they entered the league...ANCIENT HISTORY.
If you use draft position to decide who is a good QB, Kurt Warner must have been no better than training camp fodder and Johnny Manziel is better than Teddy Bridgewater. In reality only a tiny percentage of players' NFL careers can be correlated to their original draft position.
Sure, I took a small jab at Spielman by mentioning Ponder...I think he can handle it! I hope, and am fairly confident, that Spielman is not going to simply offer the biggest contract to whoever was drafted highest. Any GM who did that would be stupid or just trying to prove his draft pick was still a great one. I think Spielman may have been guilty of that at times earlier in his career, but he seems to have learned to let some high draft picks (Kalil, Patterson) walk away.
Quote: @Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
yikes, thank god you're not a GM....
Sam/Teddy are FAR from franchise QB's..... and then in the same sentence you call Cousins a system game manager.
just yikes. i rarely call people flat out wrong, it's all opinions mostly...
but that take is just wrong.
Quote: @golfervike said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
yikes, thank god you're not a GM....
Sam/Teddy are FAR from franchise QB's..... and then in the same sentence you call Cousins a system game manager.
just yikes. i rarely call people flat out wrong, it's all opinions mostly...
but that take is just wrong.
pretty sure he was referring to Case as the game manager.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
@ AGRforever said:
health in my opionion tosses Teddy out. Id rather risk it on Sam knowing if he stays healthy like 2 yrs ago hes the best option. if you want a more sure thing sign cousins or case.
I thought I read at some point Sam's knee is feeling ok and it was debunked he was bone on bone? But based on DeFillipo's comments on mobility, I wonder about Sam. Maybe they'll decide to go with him being less mobile because of his arm and accuracy?
Zim was asked about the knee in his season ending PC and he said that the issue for the surgery this year was not likely to be a career threatening issue going forward. bone on bone would IMO certainly be a career threatening issue, but he could have also been just being nice since Sam is slated to become a free agent and he didnt want to make any disparaging comments about a players health.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ AGRforever said:
health in my opionion tosses Teddy out. Id rather risk it on Sam knowing if he stays healthy like 2 yrs ago hes the best option. if you want a more sure thing sign cousins or case.
I thought I read at some point Sam's knee is feeling ok and it was debunked he was bone on bone? But based on DeFillipo's comments on mobility, I wonder about Sam. Maybe they'll decide to go with him being less mobile because of his arm and accuracy?
Zim was asked about the knee in his season ending PC and he said that the issue for the surgery this year was not likely to be a career threatening issue going forward. bone on bone would IMO certainly be a career threatening issue, but he could have also been just being nice since Sam is slated to become a free agent and he didnt want to make any disparaging comments about a players health.
That's an interesting thought, because you would not do that - give an overly-strong endorsement of a player about to become a free agent - if you wanted him back. Sounds a bit like "buttering someone's bread", where a manager sings the praises of an employee that someone else is considering hiring away.
But we're probably reading too much into every comment. Just as likely, it could mean Zimmer hopes Bradford will be his QB next year and was beginning the process of reassuring fans he will be healthy.
Quote: @Magnus10 said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ Bullazin said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Ralphie said:
@ greediron said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Take it for what it's worth. I don't think any of these guys know any more than the rest of us, but in Googling the latest chatter on Vikings' QB debate, there's definitely a buzz in the media that the Vikings may be leaning toward Teddy....
https://thevikingage.com/2018/02/12/rumo...idgewater/
NFL Update@MySportsUpdateExecutives around the league expect the #Vikings to give QB Teddy Bridgewater a short term and incentive based “prove it” type deal this offseason. They have not come to a conclusion on what they’ll do with Case Keenum.
Back in November, Over The Cap’s Jason Fitzgerald said he could see the Vikings giving Bridgewater a short-term contract this offseason worth, “between $6 million and $7 million a year plus incentives.” He also mentioned Minnesota probably will not fight to toll the quarterback’s current deal if it ends up looking like something that requires the NFLPA to get involved.
It just makes the most sense. Taking the emotion out of it. He has the most longterm upside of the 3. Give him a contract that pays him as a starter with a chance to build on it. Players usually will bet on themselves. Pay him to avoid the tolling and earn a starters salary, but allowing him to prove himself and earn the big payday. If he does, then the Vikings will be happy to pay him a top salary. If not, he made decent money and gave it a shot.
https://thevikingage.com/2018/01/23/who-...back-2018/
The above article puts the odds of the three being QB in 2018:
Sammy...20%
Case...60%
TB...80%
And the reasoning is pretty straightforward. He'd be the least expensive to sign with the best upside.
My fear is we could see a repeat with Sammy's situation...the Vikes are in the midst of a great season and TB goes down with that bad wheel. Who would be our backup and could we hope to see Case-clone 2.0?
That would be a fear with anyone. No matter who the QB is, he has to be backed up with someone qualified. Read the 3rd article I linked above. Rick calls the backup QB the 2nd most important position on the roster. And with so few appealing options out there in free agency, I keep coming back to the most ideal situation: Sam and Teddy.
Despite preferences what makes it ideal is we have 2 firsts and a 4 th invested in these 2
Ah, that's not "ideal", that's "justifying spent draft picks". I actually hope the team management is not weighing that as a factor, because it can lead to clouded judgment and weaker decision-making. If a draft pick was a mistake - and I am NOT saying either was, just IF - a smart and confident GM admits it and moves on, rather than handicapping a team with a bad Ponder. I mean bad player.
you’re a little off in your own world of Speilly bashing i think. sure it is ideal. we have 2 franchise QB’s in Teddy and Sam. Whats more ideal than that? a system QB game manager that may get 20 million a year on the open market?
Sorry I just cant agree with the statement about having 2 franchise QBs in Sam and Teddy. Sam has the arm talent to be a franchise QB and the first Saints game showed all of his capabilities. But the injuries and being on his third team kind of undermine that. At least Sam has shown he has the capability to be a franchise QB, if he can stay healthy, have a pretty clean pocket, and have some good weapons at his disposal.
Teddy just has not shown he is a franchise QB yet. He MIGHT evolve/improve and eventually get there, but there is also is a good chance he might not. Add in the knee injury and I just can't put my trust in him as THE guy.
Over the last two seasons we have had capable to good, and sometimes great, QB play from Bradford and Keenum. I think we are all in for a shock if we go all in on Teddy and find him to be about the same QB he was in 2015. He tends to hold the ball too long, check down regularly, and is not good on the deep ball. I have seen enough games where we don't break 100 yards passing. The reality is Teddy can not make the majority of the intermediate-deep throws that Sam made against the Saints, and has never produced the results we saw from Keenum this season.
I think we need to take a long look at Cousins, and if that does not work out maybe bring Case back on a shorter term contract and see if Teddy can back him up if his contract tolls. I love Sams ability to throw the ball, but given DeFillipo's comments about wanting more mobility from his QBs I am not sure if he sees a good fit there.
Exactly how many sub 100 yard games have you seen from him? I see one(99yds) week 17 in Lameblow, hardly the first time that happened there AND they won. Saying he can't make the throws is ridiculous, he can make every throw Case did and more. He doesn't have the arm talent Sam does but has better movement skills and awareness in the pocket.
Everybody has an opinion and it's expected but lets at least be real about it. I trust they will make the right call and will get behind whoever that is.
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