We really picked Turner over Jared Verse??

[Canthony]

IMO the biggest thing that made Zimmers D work was a space eater at DT that demanded a double to allow his double A blitz to work,  when Joseph was at his peak was when Zimmers D was at its best.  Dont get me wrong,  you can never go wrong with a big man that can move creating pressure in the QBs face allowing the LB to drop in coverage,  but I just never really got the "ready to explode" from Floyd ( funny thing is though... IIRC I was defending him against those calling him a bust back in the day,  I thought he could be more,  just wasnt finding it in Minny)

No doubt you are correct with Joseph. I will play the other side though, we never had that 3T that was needed. The 3T is what Zimmers defense revolved around. Could you imagine Donald, which Zimmer wanted over Barr but Ricks an idiot, in Zimmers defense? It would have been insane. Pressure with your front 4 is what his defense predicated on, and that in return, made his CBs. That strong pass rushing 3T is what we were always missing with Zimmer.

[Knucklehead]

For the last 3 years it is painfully obvious that Kwesi should have not been in position to run a draft.  The argument of Turner being 4 years younger is not a valid one, when you are picking that hight in the draft for a non-QB, it has to be an immediate impact player, not a guy you are grooming.  Then take the fact you also gave up a 3rd, 4th and 5th to move up to get him and that is a lot of picks that could have been used on a really poor OL and DL.

It's possible that Turner was picked over Verse because the team didn't figure on being competitive this season. Therefore, they selected the younger player figuring that when their competitive window opened Turner would just be entering his prime.

[JimmyinSD]

No doubt you are correct with Joseph. I will play the other side though, we never had that 3T that was needed. The 3T is what Zimmers defense revolved around. Could you imagine Donald, which Zimmer wanted over Barr but Ricks an idiot, in Zimmers defense? It would have been insane. Pressure with your front 4 is what his defense predicated on, and that in return, made his CBs. That strong pass rushing 3T is what we were always missing with Zimmer.

wasnt it Zimmer that was in love with Barr?

[Canthony]

It's possible that Turner was picked over Verse because the team didn't figure on being competitive this season. Therefore, they selected the younger player figuring that when their competitive window opened Turner would just be entering his prime.

I didn't think of this angle. That makes a ton of sense, however. Let's face it though, Tuner was always slotted to go before Verse. It wasn't like we reached for Turner. Not even close. I don't think the Vikings ever thought we could get Turner at 17.

---

wasnt it Zimmer that was in love with Barr?

From what I remember is that Zimmer wanted Donald to run the 3T. I heard that from some draft guys a few years back. I don't know what that was with Barr and Zimmer. I know Zimmer loved him as a person. They were close there. He just never used Barr near the way he was supposed to be. Zimmer was such a square peg round hole guy at times I swear.

[medaille]

Barr over Donald was a huge miss. Donald was a clear generational talent going into the draft. It was obvious. Should have drafted Donald, regardless of what Floyd did.

Turner and Verse were equally well liked going into the draft. Turner is tailor-made for Flores scheme. Verse looks like a huge stud now. Not sure if you could ask him to drop into coverage like the Vikings would want, but regardless, he'd probably still look similar to Turner on the Vikings, where he'd be behind Greenard and Van Ginkle and not get the playing time he is in LA. It be interesting to see how it would have played out if they didn't trade up for Turner. The trade up is the part I have more beef with.

[supafreak84]

For the last 3 years it is painfully obvious that Kwesi should have not been in position to run a draft.  The argument of Turner being 4 years younger is not a valid one, when you are picking that hight in the draft for a non-QB, it has to be an immediate impact player, not a guy you are grooming.  Then take the fact you also gave up a 3rd, 4th and 5th to move up to get him and that is a lot of picks that could have been used on a really poor OL and DL.

Again, I think Turner was the youngest player in the draft and despite all the athletic ability he wasn't going to overtake or take snaps away from either AVG or Greenard, who were veterans and played at Pro Bowl levels all year long. He was asked to do a lot in this complex Flores scheme that he wasn't asked to do at Alabama, including dropping into various coverages. At the end of the regular season Turner finished with 3 sacks to Verse's 4.5 sacks. I have complete confidence Turner continues to develope his all around game and comes back in 2025 a much better player.

---

Barr over Donald was a huge miss.  Donald was a clear generational talent going into the draft.  It was obvious.  Should have drafted Donald, regardless of what Floyd did.

I don't think it was clear, as Donald was drafted 13th and at least half the players drafted before him were busts. There were worries about his size and if he'd hold up against the run. I watched him play a couple times when Notre Dame played Pitt and Donald did nothing and got washed out several times in the run game. He turned out to be one of the best players ever...but it wasn't clear that was going to be the case and Anthony Barr was a multi time Pro Bowl player for us.

[MaroonBells]

Barr over Donald was a huge miss.  Donald was a clear generational talent going into the draft.  It was obvious.  Should have drafted Donald, regardless of what Floyd did.

Turner and Verse were equally well liked going into the draft.  Turner is tailor-made for Flores scheme.  Verse looks like a huge stud now.  Not sure if you could ask him to drop into coverage like the Vikings would want, but regardless, he'd probably still look similar to Turner on the Vikings, where he'd be behind Greenard and Van Ginkle and not get the playing time he is in LA.  It be interesting to see how it would have played out if they didn't trade up for Turner.  The trade up is the part I have more beef with.

It wasn't obvious to a lot of people on this board. We had countless debates about Donald. He was the best draft prospect I'd ever seen (even over Randy Moss) and I've been following the draft since the late 70s. It wasn't just his talent and ridiculous quickness and athleticism. His character and work ethic were off the charts as well. 

People thought I was nuts when I said I would've taken him 1st overall over Clowney. Most argued that he was just too small...that "he'd never beat a double team in the NFL." I'd then show clips of him beating a triple team at Pitt. Still, people were unconvinced. That thread got to be about 10 pages long. 

Another common argument was that we had just drafted our 3T the year before in Sharrif Floyd, which is an argument I would typically buy, but not in this case. Donald was just that good.