Quote: @pumpf said:
@ KingBash said:
@ pumpf said:
Compared to most world religions, Christianity held women in far higher esteem- at that time. Nowadays, though, it's popular to judge people of the past by the trends of the present.
Sexually assaulting children- however- is always evil. "Wrong" seems to be a matter of taste for a given time and place. But somethings transcend those mores; they are universally right and universally wrong. Sexually assaulting / abusing children is always wrong.
As guilty as the Catholic Church is (unfortunately, they are considered guilty by association- not so much because of the local priests and bishops but because the "higher-ups" were the ones to allow evil to fester), public school teachers have a much higher rate of child sexual abuse / assault. But no one is judging all teachers by the acts of the (relative) few... or boycotting public schools because of it. If you really do "reject" (not sure what term you would prefer) organized religion, shouldn't you also "reject" public schools?
Always gotta tie your team's wrongdoing's to another's...
The common denominator is careers (define as you will) where men are given authority over children. These careers, whether it's the Catholic church or public school teachers, are beacons of light for pedophiles.
And wherever you're getting your statistics, I'd like to see. I don't doubt it, but no well-adjusted man decides, "You know what? I'm gonna be celibate and shroud myself in a guilt-ridden life where people come to me for guidance... including children."
Also: why "public" schools? Did the study not include private? I can't see too many variables between the two that would change things.
I did the research years ago... and I posted the links back then. I'm not real interested in doing all that leg-work again. As for "public" schools- there are 2 reasons for that. One, is that the Teacher's Unions protect these pedophiles- just like the Catholic church protected theirs. Private schools have no such mechanism in place. Second, that private schools have never been surveyed / studied (near as my research can tell). So, I'm not denying that it could- and probably does- happen in private schools, too.
As for why I brought it up, it's certainly not to excuse "holy men" of committing terrible crimes. It's to remind folks that- if they really DO care about the children (and not just about attacking a religious institution), then their outrage ought to include others who are doing it, too- ESPECIALLY if those "others" are doing it at a much higher rate of incidence. PS: I'm not Catholic... so I don't consider them "my team". I think that their theology regarding justification is wrong- and, at times- damnable. So, no: they're not "my team".
Alright, I see that rationale. From the sidelines though, you see this shit going on regardless of where it is (church, school, etc.) and you wonder, Why is nobody noticing this? I know that Michael Jackson doc just came out. The whole time when they were interviewing the parents I was screaming, "You're letting your kids stay in a hotel room with a grown man?!"
Grown women, fine. I know it's a double standard, but for what I'm assuming are evolutionary purposes, women have kids' best interests at heart 99% of the time. Grown men who want to put themselves in positions where they're allowed to be alone with children are almost always perverts. (I worded that the way I did on purpose. Obviously there's nothing wrong with a dad helping coach his son's baseball team.)
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ KingBash said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Now I have. This is why I just don't even pay attention to the religious right. They're just silly. They burn calories over nonsense.
Such a well written piece.
"I would argue that it takes a true savant of exquisitely attuned grievance collection to read an individual reference to “Easter worshippers” as an attempt to avoid acknowledging Christianity."
I give you the white, conservative, evangelical Christian.
Well, it wasn't an individual reference; many on the political Left called them that. Don't you think that that's a strange designation? Also, various politicians who jumped up and posted vociferously when Muslims were killed... were silent on this. It's not a "grievance collection"; it's a response to those who say that there is not "war" on Christianity (either in our country or in others). I'm not whining about the persecution; it's expected. I'm "whining" about those who say that they don't have any particular ax to grind with Christianity... when they so clearly do. Just be honest: we know that we're hated. We accept it. It's part of the price for following Jesus. He said it was going to be this way. He also said that you'll know a "tree by its fruits". So we know what / who the trees "are"; so who are they trying to fool: themselves... or everybody else?
Quote: @KingBash said:
Alright, I see that rationale. From the sidelines though, you see this shit going on regardless of where it is (church, school, etc.) and you wonder, Why is nobody noticing this? I know that Michael Jackson doc just came out. The whole time when they were interviewing the parents I was screaming, "You're letting your kids stay in a hotel room with a grown man?!"
Grown women, fine. I know it's a double standard, but for what I'm assuming are evolutionary purposes, women have kids' best interests at heart 99% of the time. Grown men who want to put themselves in positions where they're allowed to be alone with children are almost always perverts. (I worded that the way I did on purpose. Obviously there's nothing wrong with a dad helping coach his son's baseball team.)
Here's something that we (for the most part- I don't agree about the women predators... but that's a whole 'nother debate for another time) agree on! It is evil: no matter who does it! And the people who do it ought to be punished for it (or, to put it another way, justice should be administered)- regardless of who they are: priest, teacher, coach, politician, Hollywood director, etc. Seems like this is an issue we can- and should- all rally around (likewise with child trafficking). But I think people (not me) get too caught up in either protecting their "own"... or using this crime as a way of attacking certain "enemies" (be it Catholicism or Hollywood). Too often there doesn't seem to be genuine concern for the victims; they are just "pawns" in a cultural / political war. But if you and I can agree on it, maybe there's hope for the rest of our country! 
Quote: @pumpf said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ KingBash said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Now I have. This is why I just don't even pay attention to the religious right. They're just silly. They burn calories over nonsense.
Such a well written piece.
"I would argue that it takes a true savant of exquisitely attuned grievance collection to read an individual reference to “Easter worshippers” as an attempt to avoid acknowledging Christianity."
I give you the white, conservative, evangelical Christian.
Well, it wasn't an individual reference; many on the political Left called them that. Don't you think that that's a strange designation? Also, various politicians who jumped up and posted vociferously when Muslims were killed... were silent on this. It's not a "grievance collection"; it's a response to those who say that there is not "war" on Christianity (either in our country or in others). I'm not whining about the persecution; it's expected. I'm "whining" about those who say that they don't have any particular ax to grind with Christianity... when they so clearly do. Just be honest: we know that we're hated. We accept it. It's part of the price for following Jesus. He said it was going to be this way. He also said that you'll know a "tree by its fruits". So we know what / who the trees "are"; so who are they trying to fool: themselves... or everybody else?
Haha I'll gladly carry the torch then. Yeah! Hate might be a little strong, but you guys are so fucking annoying. Because of this! You're burning calories on this fucking nonsense. No, I don't think it's a strange designation at all. And even if it's intentional, who gives a shit?!
Quote: @pumpf said:
@ KingBash said:
Alright, I see that rationale. From the sidelines though, you see this shit going on regardless of where it is (church, school, etc.) and you wonder, Why is nobody noticing this? I know that Michael Jackson doc just came out. The whole time when they were interviewing the parents I was screaming, "You're letting your kids stay in a hotel room with a grown man?!"
Grown women, fine. I know it's a double standard, but for what I'm assuming are evolutionary purposes, women have kids' best interests at heart 99% of the time. Grown men who want to put themselves in positions where they're allowed to be alone with children are almost always perverts. (I worded that the way I did on purpose. Obviously there's nothing wrong with a dad helping coach his son's baseball team.)
Here's something that we (for the most part- I don't agree about the women predators... but that's a whole 'nother debate for another time) agree on! It is evil: no matter who does it! And the people who do it ought to be punished for it (or, to put it another way, justice should be administered)- regardless of who they are: priest, teacher, coach, politician, Hollywood director, etc. Seems like this is an issue we can- and should- all rally around (likewise with child trafficking). But I think people (not me) get too caught up in either protecting their "own"... or using this crime as a way of attacking certain "enemies" (be it Catholicism or Hollywood). Too often there doesn't seem to be genuine concern for the victims; they are just "pawns" in a cultural / political war. But if you and I can agree on it, maybe there's hope for the rest of our country!
Hey, we're Vikings fans and we're against pedophiles, if we can stick to that if we ever meet, we'll get along just fine!
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ KingBash said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Now I have. This is why I just don't even pay attention to the religious right. They're just silly. They burn calories over nonsense.
Such a well written piece.
"I would argue that it takes a true savant of exquisitely attuned grievance collection to read an individual reference to “Easter worshippers” as an attempt to avoid acknowledging Christianity."
I give you the white, conservative, evangelical Christian.
Like Bono? (admit it, that's gotta hurt ) Anyways....
I agree with most/most of you/VikingOracle that the 'Easter Worshipper's' issue... was a canard, flimsy.
Here's what's interesting (to me).
Zanary's OP posted a fact of modern M(iddle)E(ast) genocide of Christians.
The responses rapidly then turned to 'Easter Worshippers, Priest abuse, Islamaphobia.'
VikingOracle's post was important...but no other concerns (re: the OP?)?
Meanwhile;, back to the OP ...Christians are indeed facing genocide in the ME.
https://www.sun-sentinel.com/florida-jew...story.html
I get it. The Church is imperfect.
But meanwhile, we neglect continental genocide?
No doubt there has been Christian persecution in the Middle East. Despise it, it's terrible. I also despise the Israeli persecution of the Palestinians, Islamic Temples in MN getting bombed and Anti-Semitism at all to high levels world-wide.
People can really suck...
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
No doubt there has been Christian persecution in the Middle East.
Not 'persecution'.
Genocide.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
No doubt there has been Christian persecution in the Middle East. Despise it, it's terrible. I also despise the Israeli persecution of the Palestinians, Islamic Temples in MN getting bombed and Anti-Semitism at all to high levels world-wide.
People can really suck...
This is kind of my foundation with these discussions. There's nastiness from/toward every religion. It just doesn't make sense to me.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
No doubt there has been Christian persecution in the Middle East. Despise it, it's terrible. I also despise the Israeli persecution of the Palestinians, Islamic Temples in MN getting bombed and Anti-Semitism at all to high levels world-wide.
People can really suck...
While it's true that people being hateful and hurtful towards others is a terrible thing, it's not quite accurate to lump Christian persecution in with others- simply because of the vast numbers of Christians being persecuted. That doesn't mean that it doesn't suck when it happens to others... but it should be noted that it happens ALOT more to Christians. See the links:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/chris...under-fire
https://www.worldwatchmonitor.org/coe/80...hristians/
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