Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Keep Reiff at LT, keep O'Neill at RT for now. Sign either Saffold or Easton at LG, move Elflein to RG. Draft Risner at 18 to play center (Risner also gives us depth at every other position except left tackle). Draft future LT or RT Edoga in the 3rd.
With Collins and Isidora as experienced depth, this is suddenly a solid, versatile and deep offensive line with 3 players capable of playing center (if Easton), 5 at tackle (if Saffold) and 5 at guard.
i am with all of that except moving Elf. I know he was a good OG in college, but i really question if he has the lead in his ass to play OG in the pros. at Center he is a bit protected from having to single up on a monster DT, but at OG he will find himself without help quite a bit. and I really thought he played C quite well as a rookie and that he could still show a lot of improvement and growth at the position.
Agreed. And his leadership in calling protections changed our line dramatically.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Keep Reiff at LT, keep O'Neill at RT for now. Sign either Saffold or Easton at LG, move Elflein to RG. Draft Risner at 18 to play center (Risner also gives us depth at every other position except left tackle). Draft future LT or RT Edoga in the 3rd.
With Collins and Isidora as experienced depth, this is suddenly a solid, versatile and deep offensive line with 3 players capable of playing center (if Easton), 5 at tackle (if Saffold) and 5 at guard.
i am with all of that except moving Elf. I know he was a good OG in college, but i really question if he has the lead in his ass to play OG in the pros. at Center he is a bit protected from having to single up on a monster DT, but at OG he will find himself without help quite a bit. and I really thought he played C quite well as a rookie and that he could still show a lot of improvement and growth at the position.
Well, we're all just guessing at what we're going to be looking for now that Kubiak (and his minions) will be dictating the makeup of our offensive line.
I would say that, based on his draft profile anyway, Elflein's strengths were precisely the lead in his ass--his leverage and leadership, and his weakness was his footwork and athleticism. Will Kubiak want a more zone-friendly center?
I keep thinking about what Kyle Shanahan (another zone evangelist) did right after drafting McGlinchey. He traded his behemoth, and ill-fit-in-a-zone, right tackle Trent Brown to the Patriots.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Keep Reiff at LT, keep O'Neill at RT for now. Sign either Saffold or Easton at LG, move Elflein to RG. Draft Risner at 18 to play center (Risner also gives us depth at every other position except left tackle). Draft future LT or RT Edoga in the 3rd.
With Collins and Isidora as experienced depth, this is suddenly a solid, versatile and deep offensive line with 3 players capable of playing center (if Easton), 5 at tackle (if Saffold) and 5 at guard.
i am with all of that except moving Elf. I know he was a good OG in college, but i really question if he has the lead in his ass to play OG in the pros. at Center he is a bit protected from having to single up on a monster DT, but at OG he will find himself without help quite a bit. and I really thought he played C quite well as a rookie and that he could still show a lot of improvement and growth at the position.
Well, we're all just guessing at what we're going to be looking for now that Kubiak (and his minions) will be dictating the makeup of our offensive line.
I would say that, based on his draft profile anyway, Elflein's strengths were precisely the lead in his ass--his leverage and leadership, and his weakness was his footwork and athleticism. Will Kubiak want a more zone-friendly center?
I keep thinking about what Kyle Shanahan (another zone evangelist) did right after drafting McGlinchey. He traded his behemoth, and ill-fit-in-a-zone, right tackle Trent Brown to the Patriots.
Elfs top attribute is his strong wrestling background, being able to maximize his leverage and use his opponents momentum against them when necessary.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ Bullazin said:
Reiff can kick inside and produce at a high level way faster than a rookie OT. Guy is a captain for a reason
what does captain have to do with position flexibility? LJ is a team captain, but I dont think he would do shit at DE or LB.
I guess youve gotta think about it awhile in order to understand.
Another thing about moving Reiff: his cap hit in 2019 is $11.7M. That's OK for OT (projected currently at 13th in the NFL), but 7th highest OG.
I'm cautious about moving him to either RT (didn't do well there in Detroit) or OG. Leave LT and RT alone for another year and work on the interior. Vikings will probably move on from Reiff a year from now when his salary increases but his dead cap drops a lot.
Quote: @Jor-El said:
Another thing about moving Reiff: his cap hit in 2019 is $11.7M. That's OK for OT (projected currently at 13th in the NFL), but 7th highest OG.
I'm cautious about moving him to either RT (didn't do well there in Detroit) or OG. Leave LT and RT alone for another year and work on the interior. Vikings will probably move on from Reiff a year from now when his salary increases but his dead cap drops a lot.
true and he is a pretty OK tackle so we are fine with him there. im hoping his foot was the cause of his downtick in pass pro. i wouldnt doubt for a second he would play hurt if he thought he could help the team.
As others pointed out he is the least of our worries in the OL. i wanted but failed to make a clear point that Reif would excel at LG way more reasonably than drafting a college T and moving them inside.
As to the failure of Remmers to move inside and succeed, theres no comparing skillsets between Remmers and Reif.
taking a "subpar" LT out of his natural position and assuming a great RT will be a great LT sounds like a recipe for disaster. This is something that could have been tried already. The coaching staff could have spoken up and it would have been done. This rotation could have at least been attempted so there is actually film supporting the idea.
To sit here at the end of the season saying, "wait, all we need to do is shuffle these guys around!" is exactly the type of shit i'm tired of this front office doing. This is totally something that could have happened around Week 7, not an off-season solution to our issues on the line.
How did this work out for Mike Remmers at RG? It's a do nothing and pretend we're better fantasy. We had O'Neil to play RT - moving O'Neil to LT and Reiff to LG gives us 2 players playing new positions and hands someone the RT tackle position. Move Remmers back outside? Who's playing RG? Forget moving people around as a solution and just fill the fucking holes on the line. You can move these guys around easy in OTAs and Camp if it's not happening... but to do nothing but rely on something you could have already done... it's just.... uuughhh...
This is like being forced to watch a bad movie again. My all time worst movie was ...
The Attack of the Killer Tomatoes"
... awful. Just awful.
Now Rieff is no tomato but moving him to guard should come with a roll of duct tape.
I don't think this an awful idea, but it isn't great either. It ultimately depends what the larger plan is to fill the other four positions. It does give the team more options as they approach free agency and the draft. Historically the Vikings have felt more comfortable drafting OT's early vs. guards. With O'Neill having some flexibility it would allow them to draft a day one starter (hopefully) and play them on their natural side. That still leaves a gap at RG but that is maybe where you target a guy in free agency or trade. Follow it up with a mid to late round pick and re-sign Easton or Compton for near the minimum and you actually have a decent talent pool.
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
I don't think this an awful idea, but it isn't great either. It ultimately depends what the larger plan is to fill the other four positions. It does give the team more options as they approach free agency and the draft. Historically the Vikings have felt more comfortable drafting OT's early vs. guards. With O'Neill having some flexibility it would allow them to draft a day one starter (hopefully) and play them on their natural side. That still leaves a gap at RG but that is maybe where you target a guy in free agency or trade. Follow it up with a mid to late round pick and re-sign Easton or Compton for near the minimum and you actually have a decent talent pool.
Geoff have you heard any news on Eastons injury? He is UFA and possibly signing for the min? sounds like a big turnaround from a 2nd rd tender
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