Quote: @NodakViking said:
@ FSUVike said:
And some of you are very quick to dismiss any criticism of a HC who just improved to 2-8 against Division Opponents.
Where did you come up with that? 9-11 overall in 3.3 years after a 1-5 rookie year that is 8-6 since then.
Maybe it was a mutual decision by all parties to give it a go, as it is Sam likely has a degenerative condition in his knee and will need to learn to play with that brace the rest of his years like Palmer or get microfracture surgery. It think it's pretty clear from circumstantial evidence he has bone on bone which likely means he has damaged meniscus in that knee-the only way to "replace" it is microfracture surgery or knee replacement. The other option is to use that brace and deal with the problem until your career is over then get a replacement joint later in life.
His best bet if he wants to play 6-8 more years is go on IR(designated for return) and do what he can to fix the knee.
Dunno, 2-8 sounds much better when making his point about knee-jerks. But how would that even work? We play 6 games a year against divisional foes. So two years is 12 games...
That line was scrolling across the bottom of the Redzone on Sunday. Like every time they flashed through who was playing on Monday night.
Did they get the teams backwards?
Doesn't change any of my or TBro or MGB.or Jor-Els points or questions.
Quote: @prairieghost said:
The national media has been all over this, saying that the Vikings have jeopardized Bradford's career by sending him out before he was ready, that the Vikings are irresponsible....yada, yada, yada....It's BS. I can guarantee that if we had lost that game with Keenum playing from start to finish then the media would proclaim the Vikings the stupidest bunch of SOBs in the NFL for sitting Bradford for a game that he was ready to play. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
If Zimmer had started Keenum, lost, and been criticized, he would have said, "Sam could not play, we saw he was not comfortable when he practiced." How would he have been damned? Sure, Bradford would be criticized for some reason, and some might say Zimmer was overly cautious. But no one would have eyewitness evidence to contradict Zimmer saying Bradford wasn't ready to go.
This is being debated because the team said Bradford was ready and the entire world could see he was not. We and ESPN and whoever else are debating this because Bradford's game condition does not agree with the idea he could have looked good in practice.
Quote: @Jor-El said:
@ prairieghost said:
The national media has been all over this, saying that the Vikings have jeopardized Bradford's career by sending him out before he was ready, that the Vikings are irresponsible....yada, yada, yada....It's BS. I can guarantee that if we had lost that game with Keenum playing from start to finish then the media would proclaim the Vikings the stupidest bunch of SOBs in the NFL for sitting Bradford for a game that he was ready to play. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
If Zimmer had started Keenum, lost, and been criticized, he would have said, "Sam could not play, we saw he was not comfortable when he practiced." How would he have been damned? Sure, Bradford would be criticized for some reason, and some might say Zimmer was overly cautious. But no one would have eyewitness evidence to contradict Zimmer saying Bradford wasn't ready to go.
This is being debated because the team said Bradford was ready and the entire world could see he was not. We and ESPN and whoever else are debating this because Bradford's game condition does not agree with the idea he could have looked good in practice.
So there would have been no conspiracies about Bradford holding himself out or Zimmer being scared or Spielman tanking the season? Zimmer had an answer for all the questions raised above, but that doesn't stop the theories.
For what it's worth (which ain't much when folks already have their minds made up), PA was saying that Bradford looked great in practice all week. If that's so, then why would Zimmer be quick to give him the hook (especially when he could've just been rusty- and may have been able to work through it)?
Quote: @greediron said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ prairieghost said:
The national media has been all over this, saying that the Vikings have jeopardized Bradford's career by sending him out before he was ready, that the Vikings are irresponsible....yada, yada, yada....It's BS. I can guarantee that if we had lost that game with Keenum playing from start to finish then the media would proclaim the Vikings the stupidest bunch of SOBs in the NFL for sitting Bradford for a game that he was ready to play. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
If Zimmer had started Keenum, lost, and been criticized, he would have said, "Sam could not play, we saw he was not comfortable when he practiced." How would he have been damned? Sure, Bradford would be criticized for some reason, and some might say Zimmer was overly cautious. But no one would have eyewitness evidence to contradict Zimmer saying Bradford wasn't ready to go.
This is being debated because the team said Bradford was ready and the entire world could see he was not. We and ESPN and whoever else are debating this because Bradford's game condition does not agree with the idea he could have looked good in practice.
So there would have been no conspiracies about Bradford holding himself out or Zimmer being scared or Spielman tanking the season? Zimmer had an answer for all the questions raised above, but that doesn't stop the theories.
Allow me an an analogy.
In WWII, D-Day was launched at Eisenhower's directive on June 6, 1944. People had been urging him to invade Europe earlier, in 1943 or even sooner. But Eisenhower insisted on waiting until they were sure to have the sufficient advantage to make success more likely. Did people second-guess the delay or speculate that it should have been sooner? Sure, but no one can show an earlier invasion would have worked.
But suppose he invaded in 1943 and the Allies were repelled; in fact, the invasion was obviously not ready, with insufficient landing craft, no Mulberry docks, ships unable to even cross the channel.
Then on top of it, what if Eisenhower INSISTED that the Allies had planned and conducted mock invasions, and he said that it always worked great in the practice invasions and he can't understand what went wrong. But there are witnesses who could see the invasion was obviously not well-prepared. To them, it seems like Eisenhower can't be right about the practice invasions going well.
Don't you think the second case, going too early and looking unprepared and failing and the leader claiming he thought they were prepared, would generate a lot more controversy? Even if the Allies eventually won the war by turning to a backup QB invasion, in the latter case people witnessed the failure. Complaints about delaying would have just been speculation with no demonstrated evidence.
However, Eisenhower would NEVER, NEVER have made excuses. I have read the statements he prepared in case of failure and there is no question he would have personally accepted full responsibility for any failure.
Mike Zimmer, sir, is no Eisenhower.
Pardon the historical speculation...
lol. And none of us are anything but armchair coaches and GMs. So I will take his word (and others who saw Bradford practice) over all these.
Quote: @pumpf said:
For what it's worth (which ain't much when folks already have their minds made up), PA was saying that Bradford looked great in practice all week. If that's so, then why would Zimmer be quick to give him the hook (especially when he could've just been rusty- and may have been able to work through it)?
because it doesnt fit with agendas or people that think they are smarter than medical professionals, professional athletic trainers, professional athletes and professional coaches.
the fact that he wore a brace means jack shit, players play with limiting braces all the time, but some people hear a new word and freak the hell out and run around spouting shit like they know what it is. of course those of use that trust the professionals are just sheep, or lemmings, or any of a number of other belittling terms that internet experts like to throw around.
arent message boards fun!
Just my opinion, but I have to believe that this lingering knee issue with Bradford has cost him a long term deal here in Minnesota. There is just no way the Vikings can jump in with him knowing this issue could be something that could flare up at any time and could ultimately cut his career short. I think the Vikings let him walk in free agency after this season.
Bridgewater is still an unknown with his knee. He's another one you can't count on long term and will also be a free agent after the season.
To me, the best option is to sign Case Keenum to a moderate extension and look to once again draft the QB of the future. Not sure the Vikings would get in on big money bidding over Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garopollo. This should definitely be an interesting offseason in Minnesota when it comes to the QB position.
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
Just my opinion, but I have to believe that this lingering knee issue with Bradford has cost him a long term deal here in Minnesota. There is just no way the Vikings can jump in with him knowing this issue could be something that could flare up at any time and could ultimately cut his career short. I think the Vikings let him walk in free agency after this season.
Bridgewater is still an unknown with his knee. He's another one you can't count on long term and will also be a free agent after the season.
To me, the best option is to sign Case Keenum to a moderate extension and look to once again draft the QB of the future. Not sure the Vikings would get in on big money bidding over Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garopollo. This should definitely be an interesting offseason in Minnesota when it comes to the QB position.
I agree to an extent, I wouldn't throw a lot of guaranteed money at Sam anymore, but an incentive deal based on games played is still possible imo depending on how quickly he is able to bounce back from this, and if they can find a better brace to help reduce the chance of future flare ups.
Teddy is still up on the air. Depending on what the docs say, he could be completely fine and have only marginally more risk of future injury than any kid coming out of college. If his contract tolls I think rolling with Sam on a very team friendly deal and Teddy on a tolled contract might be a good plan while we find out what we have in a young guy.
They will know by seasons end if Sloter is for real if he is, grab a mid round draft pick to come in and compete for the #3 spot with him, if not we need to go first or second round and get a guy that should be competing for the #2 spot in a year or possibly a starter.
With all the potential talent at the position expected in the draft, I don't expect the free agent market to he quite as blistering this offseason. Even if theRE is big first year money, I expect the total guaranteed size of the contracts for guys like cousins Bradford and even maybe garrappalo to be more prove it deals or incentive laden. Cousins doesn't impress consistently enough, Bradford's knee, and jg is unproven....hard to overspend in the year of the QB imo.
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