Quote: @MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
Define "fault". Are you talking absolute causality? That's a high bar to hit, because single variable causality only exists in basic algebra. He does have some responsibility for his actions. He didn't deserve to die. Nobody here thinks he deserved to die. I don't know of any reasonable person who thinks he deserved to die. However, his actions played some part in the unfortunate result.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
maybe its you that has something wrong... the cop told the stoned guy with a gun not to reach, the guy reached. what part of that is on the cop?
The part where he doesn't even see a gun but shoots 7 shots into a car with a family of three inside who's only crime was a faulty tail light.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
maybe its you that has something wrong... the cop told the stoned guy with a gun not to reach, the guy reached. what part of that is on the cop?
The part where he doesn't even see a gun but shoots 7 shots into a car with a family of three inside who's only crime was a faulty tail light.
he was told that he had a gun and was reaching for it. after that everything else you wrote is secondary. yes he likely didnt need to shoot 7 times, but his hand was forced when it came to pulling his weapon, but I am sure we will never agree on that so adoo.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
maybe its you that has something wrong... the cop told the stoned guy with a gun not to reach, the guy reached. what part of that is on the cop?
The part where he doesn't even see a gun but shoots 7 shots into a car with a family of three inside who's only crime was a faulty tail light.
concealed carry while under the influence is illegal, is it not? Wonder what reasoning went into that law?
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
Blame the victim...classic...I guess the way he was dressed he was asking for it...J-word indeed...
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
There is something seriously wrong with people who think this is Castille's fault. Jesus. Murder or manslaughter is a tough one because the lines are so often blurred for cops. But reckless endangerment, you bet. And I think Castille's family deserves every penny they get.
maybe its you that has something wrong... the cop told the stoned guy with a gun not to reach, the guy reached. what part of that is on the cop?
The part where he doesn't even see a gun but shoots 7 shots into a car with a family of three inside who's only crime was a faulty tail light.
he was told that he had a gun and was reaching for it. after that everything else you wrote is secondary. yes he likely didnt need to shoot 7 times, but his hand was forced when it came to pulling his weapon, but I am sure we will never agree on that so adoo.
Well, it wasn't his only crime. Failure to obey a police officer is a misdemeanor and being high in a state where marijuana is not legal is also a crime. We will never know what he was going to do once his hand reached what he was reaching for... but I'm 99% sure he was reaching for his wallet and not the gun to shoot the officer. He might have been reaching to move his gun to get at his wallet too. But once again, put yourself in the officer's shoes. Let's not forget that LEO were on edge due to 2016 being a bad year for them with 22 being shot in the first half of the year. Relations between the public and the police had be under stress for a few years. Not that that is an excuse, just listing facts that could effect behaviors. So this man told you he has a gun, you tell him not to reach for it, he says he is going to anyway. Now... why would a person do that? Disobey an officer who clearly doesn't want them reaching for a weapon... why continue to do so? As an officer what would you do?
Wait and see what happens? Tell him to freeze right now? Easy to decide while sitting behind a screen. His survival instincts kicked in. He saw a threat and reacted, he reached into the car and tried to stop the man from reaching for whatever, once he couldn't stop that... survival instinct went into overdrive(7 shots) and he "defended himself" against what he considered an armed person. More than likely he reacted incorrectly but we will never know for sure.
I feel like I'm supporting the officer more than I should. I'm not really he has blame in this. I'm glad he's no longer on a police force, I'm just not sure he should be blamed 100%.
My .02 cents, The guy should never have been carrying in his state of mind, that is illegal and will cost you your right to carry in most states, but the police officer over reacted, if I have my gun aimed at you like the LEO did, and you are reaching for your gun and I tell you to stop but you still keep reaching, I dont feel the need to shoot you until you actually have the gun fully out, as his life is not in danger as of yet. With that said, I dont know how I would react in that LEOs shoes. Not sure why people just cant do what they are asked to do. I have never had a problem with cops.
Quote: @"Viking Bob" said:
My .02 cents, The guy should never have been carrying in his state of mind, that is illegal and will cost you your right to carry in most states, but the police officer over reacted, if I have my gun aimed at you like the LEO did, and you are reaching for your gun and I tell you to stop but you still keep reaching, I dont feel the need to shoot you until you actually have the gun fully out, as his life is not in danger as of yet. With that said, I dont know how I would react in that LEOs shoes. Not sure why people just cant do what they are asked to do. I have never had a problem with cops.
thats kind of where I am at, the deceased ( not a victim IMO) created the situation ( over 50 previous incidents with the law IIRC) it is tragic that it went down as it did, and the LEO certainly could have handled it better in hindsight, but he reacted as he was trained, maybe with to much vigor, but he did what he was trained to do. as far as when you would have pulled the trigger... nobody knows until they are faced with a situation how they will react. pretty easy to say I would do this or that in a classroom or behind a computer, but until its real, we really dont know.
Every time I watch the video I see the same thing: A poorly trained cop and a scared kid and a bunch of lives ruined.
I'd like to hear some thoughts on the OP.
We have a police officer shooting a legally armed citizen who was stopped under apparently false pretense.
And the NRA says what??
Quote: @Vikeshrink said:
Every time I watch the video I see the same thing: A poorly trained cop and a scared kid and a bunch of lives ruined.
I'd like to hear some thoughts on the OP.
We have a police officer shooting a legally armed citizen who was stopped under apparently false pretense.
And the NRA says what??
I guess we all see what we want to see.
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