I was critical of Keenum when he was announced as the starter this week. His overall record and inconsistent play did not give me much hope against a solid Bucs Team. He looked incredible today. I need to apologize for jumping out of the Long Ship too early. It's only one week, but if we continue the solid line play and Dalvin maintains his ability as a run/pass threat who can pick up the blitz, we have a good shot of keeping pace with the good NFC teams while we wait for Bradford to get healthy. Lions will be a tough test next week. Jim Bob creates a great gameplan against our defense, and Stafford will be coming into this game with some anger and motivation after that TD got reversed and the runoff left them with no time. We can't afford to lose any home games against Division Rivals.
Lets also remember he is 3-0 against the bucs and 7-16 against all others. Great game. Not a great career.
Biggest difference to me was his pocket presence, as was mentioned many times during the game. Last week he was running out of it more than he needed, this week he was staying in the seams and moving to his protection. Hope it was just a function of reps and he can do it consistently.
He was getting the ball out of his hand quick.
He was mentally all over their defensive schemes and coverage. We were very aggressive with our play calls and Keenum kept reading it right and made some great throws. I hope that if he starts next week, he's as dialed into what the defense is doing as he was against Tampa.
Against the Steelers, we started very predictable trying to keep the game out of Keenum's hands. Lots of runs to set up managable passing situations. Once we found a passing rhythm, the Steelers quickly adjusted, sent pressure, and confused us. They dialed in and kept killing our drives. It was the opposite against Tampa. We were aggressive throwing from the start, and we were on top of their adjustments. They were on their heels all game and couldnt really catch up until we started managing the clock towards the end of the game.
For me, the thing with Keenum is he had experience starting in the NFL. He has played his way into being a league backup, but hes not an old guy. He's developing as much as any other QB. I didnt think he had the type of performance he had in him, but I did/do think he's a lot more capable of a player than someone like Shaun Hill. We can be competitive if he has to play.
I think we'd all love to see some more of that.... It may have been one of the best single game quarterbacking performances in Vikings history.
When Bradford comes back, we'll move forward there. Until then, do it again!
Quote: @BigAl99 said:
Biggest difference to me was his pocket presence, as was mentioned many times during the game. Last week he was running out of it more than he needed, this week he was staying in the seams and moving to his protection. Hope it was just a function of reps and he can do it consistently.
I agree Case looked very comfortable in the pocket with pressure surrounding him. He made several nice plays stepping up "into" the pocket while looking downfield.
Yep, he was great, and it was pretty unexpected. Part of me wants to get a bigger sample size for evaluating Keenum; part of me wants to get Bradford back and keep Keenum as a reserve when needed.
The past two weeks have really taken away confidence about the QB position. After a year of many people taking sides as either "Team Teddy" or "Team Sam", are we all seeing that either of those guys is going to be potential "out unexpectedly due to flareup of old knee injury" for the rest of their careers? I'm feeling like we need a different option. Not sure if Case has ability to become a long-term starter, or if we need to think Sloter/draft.
OTOH, does Keenum's success yesterday show that a good OL and a good OC make every QB more effective? Maybe Vikings should have acquired those elements before prioritizing the QB position.
Quote: @Jor-El said:
OTOH, does Keenum's success yesterday show that a good OL and a good OC make every QB more effective? Maybe Vikings should have acquired those elements before prioritizing the QB position.
It amazes me that so few GMs actually figure this out. Seems so simple.
Now in our case, I think Spielman thought he had it in place, but our depth was severely lacking and when injuries hit, it killed us.
Weeks 1 and 3 vs Week 2; I think the success partially shows that quick decision making and a quick release make the offensive line more effective. Keenum held the ball longer against the Steelers and he didn't really adjust his speed up to our playcalling once we started focusing on the pass. The Steelers tuned in to it and really started dialing up pressure. Week 2, it was a bad combination. Week 3, Keenum was ready to throw the ball and Tampa never really caught up to our playcalling. Keenum never really hesitated with the ball and it was a big difference between the two games.
Even Bradford week 1, the line looked pretty good during the game, then there was an article about how the performance wasn't as good as we thought... it largely was irrelevant just because Bradford got rid of the ball before it mattered.
Consistency of play along the offensive line certainly makes it easier for a QB to play fast, make quick decisions and frustrate a defense. Our line has allowed our QBs to be comfortable running the offense.
Quote: @greediron said:
@ Jor-El said:
OTOH, does Keenum's success yesterday show that a good OL and a good OC make every QB more effective? Maybe Vikings should have acquired those elements before prioritizing the QB position.
It amazes me that so few GMs actually figure this out. Seems so simple.
Now in our case, I think Spielman thought he had it in place, but our depth was severely lacking and when injuries hit, it killed us.
Perhaps. I think you are referring to the OL near the beginning of 2016: Kalil, Boone, Sullivan, Fusco, Loadholt, with Berger, Clemmings, and Andre Smith? But I think that was Spielman always assuming the best will happen: Kalil will return to his 2012 form, Boone will be better than ever before and inspire his linemates, Sullivan and Loadholt will recover fully, and Fusco will return to his pre-injury form. Spielman needs to plan for worst-case scenarios. (I also think he buys into the myth that Sugarman will take EVERY player to full recovery after surgery.)
But the other piece of what we are seeing this year has to be Shurmur - and beyond play-calling, I think his shifting the blocking scheme to more zone has been a key to our OL improvement. In Norv Turner, we had a behind-the-times OC who didn't adjust to the personnel he had.
Quote: @Jor-El said:
@ greediron said:
@ Jor-El said:
OTOH, does Keenum's success yesterday show that a good OL and a good OC make every QB more effective? Maybe Vikings should have acquired those elements before prioritizing the QB position.
It amazes me that so few GMs actually figure this out. Seems so simple.
Now in our case, I think Spielman thought he had it in place, but our depth was severely lacking and when injuries hit, it killed us.
Perhaps. I think you are referring to the OL near the beginning of 2016: Kalil, Boone, Sullivan, Fusco, Loadholt, with Berger, Clemmings, and Andre Smith? But I think that was Spielman always assuming the best will happen: Kalil will return to his 2012 form, Boone will be better than ever before and inspire his linemates, Sullivan and Loadholt will recover fully, and Fusco will return to his pre-injury form. Spielman needs to plan for worst-case scenarios. (I also think he buys into the myth that Sugarman will take EVERY player to full recovery after surgery.)
But the other piece of what we are seeing this year has to be Shurmur - and beyond play-calling, I think his shifting the blocking scheme to more zone has been a key to our OL improvement. In Norv Turner, we had a behind-the-times OC who didn't adjust to the personnel he had.
Ignoring your sugarman tinfoilage, yes, I think Spielman failed to draft quality depth and future for the line. That is what I meant, Spielman neglected our o-line and it killed us last year.
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