Dobbs did hit his ceiling… and it was the first half of the Saints game.
Maybe this is a poor choice of words by OP but how can you say last night was his ceiling when he played so much better last week?
And as OP points out— we don’t have any other great options. I’m curious about Hall too but the odds he could’ve played any better than Dobbs did last night (even if he was healthy) seem low. Denver’s defense is very good and they took away almost all of the big plays, fake punt aside. Because of this, Addison was a ghost. They forced us into long drives and correctly guessed that eventually we’d turn the ball over, because it’s us.
The pass blocking got smoked quite a bit even though the run blocking was solid.
Dobbs is fine and I thought with a minute left we’d have a decent chance to get a FG try. Sadly that’s when they really dialed up the pressure and blew up what we wanted to do. It happens. We lost by 1 point to a good team in their house.
JJ would have made a huge difference I think and also Chandler should be playing firmly ahead of Mattison. That change needs to happen this week. To me our RB situation closely mirrors Buffalo’s. The difference is James Cook gets most of the touches for them, not Latavius Murray.
I think people have too high of expectations. People were a little delusional coming off
the last two games. I know people are
clamoring over how smart he is, but he’s still a QB who hasn’t fully learned
the offense yet. He’s not going to be as
quick at processing things as a guy who’s been through training camp and the
full season of gameplanning. He’s going
to run into situations where the defense does stuff differently than he
anticipates and it’s not going to be muscle memory on what he should do. I think a lot of how good Dobbs looks in a
game is going to come down to how well KOC predicts what the defense is going
to do and prepares them for that. I don’t
think it’s surprising that he’s struggling a little more in the second halves
as defenses make adjustments, because the foundational understanding of the
offense just isn’t there yet and you can’t pivot to “Hey remember that thing we
did 5 weeks ago?” I think we’re just
going to need the team to carry Dobbs more than we need Dobbs to carry the team.
I don’t think this is his ceiling. That’s a ridiculous take. I don’t think you just drop a rookie QB in
there and expect much different. Rookie
QBs make mistakes all the time. I think
Dobbs with a KOC training camp would go a long way towards establishing his ceiling,
and I think people forget how long it took Cousins to develop comfort and
mastery of this offense. I do think one
thing he really needs to clean up is ball security when he’s running. He holds the ball out there a little bit too
much.
Dobbs is a great story and saved an otherwise disastrous season for me/from a fans perspective. The die was cast last week on how to beat him -- take away the run and make him pass.
He'll make some plays that make you applaud, but overall his passing isnt elite, he misses too many open receivers and forces too many balls into places you can't vs an nfl defense.
I dont know if after 7 seasons in the league if he is under or over-performing?
I'll just enjoy the rest of the way, see if we can get into post-season.
Hell, if KOC can get this team into the post-season dance? thats the #1 story of the 23 Vikings, not Dobbs.
Quote: @"ThunderGod" said:
@"JimmyinSD" said:
@"TBro" said:
Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB.
I agree, this changes nothing IMO on Cousins. Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night, so this loss is not solely off his shoulders, but as you say, its week 3 is all, just as people were to quick to jump in the hype, they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train. IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there, then be looking to Mullins or Hall.
Either way, I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.
i agree with everything except playing Mullins. We know Mullins. They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.
Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.
Dobbs has made a lost season after Cousins fun. I don't really have any expectations. He is going to win some and lose some. But with all the issues last night (OL, Addison, Hockenson, Mattison), a meltdown was possible, it just increased the odds. With the wins, Hockenson and Addison were making great plays and the OL was much better. There were many times last night where the OL lost instantly and the pocket collapsed. Granted, I don't expect them to win every time. And for the love of all that is sacred and holy, more Chandler please. Also he is learning the offense each week, he just learned his teammates names. I don't know what some people were expecting. And I love the pile on post after disappearing when they were winning
Quote: @"TBro" said:
@"AGRforever" said:
Last night was by far Dobbs worst performance since showing up in MN. It wasn’t even the ball placement. There were some legit very bad decisions. Not 50/50 balls. Just bad, rookie like decisions.
We’ll see as the time goes on. Was Dobbs of the Saint first half the norm or Dobbs the second half Broncos?
Fun story though and I was entertained!!
. At least he won't take Tuesday's off like Cousins and will continue to put in the work with KOC to get better every week.
Really? They don't have an eye roll emoji.....but really?
As for Dobbs, we got the guy for unloading Ezra Cleveland, who wasn't going to be on our team next year anyway. A starting guard for a starting QB wasn't to bad when we had a guard to available to get rid of. It was essentially a no risk trade in a desperate spot. I actually got to watch some of the QB play yesterday. League wide its atrocious. Dobbs isn't going to light up the league by any means but he's pretty darn close to average or even above average compared to what I saw yesterday. To have picked him up for nothing was when we did was a home run.
We're not winning the Superbowl this year. But its been entertaining to say the least.
Quote: @"pattersaur" said:
Dobbs did hit his ceiling… and it was the first half of the Saints game.
Maybe this is a poor choice of words by OP but how can you say last night was his ceiling when he played so much better last week?
And as OP points out— we don’t have any other great options. I’m curious about Hall too but the odds he could’ve played any better than Dobbs did last night (even if he was healthy) seem low. Denver’s defense is very good and they took away almost all of the big plays, fake punt aside. Because of this, Addison was a ghost. They forced us into long drives and correctly guessed that eventually we’d turn the ball over, because it’s us.
The pass blocking got smoked quite a bit even though the run blocking was solid.
Dobbs is fine and I thought with a minute left we’d have a decent chance to get a FG try. Sadly that’s when they really dialed up the pressure and blew up what we wanted to do. It happens. We lost by 1 point to a good team in their house.
JJ would have made a huge difference I think and also Chandler should be playing firmly ahead of Mattison. That change needs to happen this week. To me our RB situation closely mirrors Buffalo’s. The difference is James Cook gets most of the touches for them, not Latavius Murray.
Denver and MN are pretty evenly matched teams. Neither are elite, but neither are bottom feeders either.
JJ probably would have made a difference last night. BUT - I have no idea how he and Dobbs will mesh (or not). I'm not convinced it'll work seamlessly.
How Mattison gets that many more carries than Chandler doesnt compute with me either.
Dobbs was basically free from a picks perspective, relax and enjoy the ride
KOC was forcing Dobbs to be Cousins, instead of creating a game plan to take advantage of his skills. We did standard deep drop backs all game long, not one rollout or designed QB run, Dobbs mobility and speed is his best asset and we did not game plan for it at all. KOC tried to stuff a round peg into a square hole all night and it was frustrating to watch as he just stifled what he is good at and forced him to be what he is not. Dobbs is not a pure pocket passer, you can tell how uncomfortable he gets there, he needs to be able to create on the run. Denver defense was able to just bring it without a worry of him running.
Quote: @"JR44" said:
KOC was forcing Dobbs to be Cousins, instead of creating a game plan to take advantage of his skills. We did standard deep drop backs all game long, not one rollout or designed QB run, Dobbs mobility and speed is his best asset and we did not game plan for it at all. KOC tried to stuff a round peg into a square hole all night and it was frustrating to watch as he just stifled what he is good at and forced him to be what he is not. Dobbs is not a pure pocket passer, you can tell how uncomfortable he gets there, he needs to be able to create on the run. Denver defense was able to just bring it without a worry of him running.
I agree, but just a little.
I did see more designed runs and call for Dobbs, but we also have to give Denver DC credit. They took the 2nd 1/2 tape from the Saints game and learned from it.
How you beat Dobbs is not rocket science; you make him pass and stop his running with blitzes - which is what they did last night.
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