Quote: @"Vanguard83" said:
weve all heard the talking heads say “look at how tough this kid is - stays in the pocket and delivers the ball at the last minute even though he gets popped”
Not with Cousins - “He holds the ball to long”
I don't know that I've ever seen a QB stay in the pocket until the last minute and fire a ridiculously accurate ball with linemen in his face (or draped all over his legs) as much as I saw Kirk do that last season. There may not be a tougher QB in the NFL.
Quote: @"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"AGRforever" said:
@"Vanguard83" said:
KC isnt the problem. Put a defense that gets after people out there, and we will get to the SB. Last year was an amazing run, but we all knew our D was hot garbage.
It doesn’t even have to be a top D. Just average.
Definitely, we need defensive improvement, but here's a couple of realities...not opinions:
1. Both KC and Philly had top-5 offensive lines last season.
2. Our QB was the most-hit in the league (and he's typical among the most hit).
Kirk has been pummeled since he got to Minnesota, as have most of our QBs for over a decade. We finally have goot OTs, but we really need Bradbury and Ingram to step WAY up this season.
Both Philly and KC have ultra mobile QBs. Think about it. How many times do you see Mahomes escaping pressure and throwing a TD. A lot. But the narrative is never about the failure on the OL, is it? It's about Mahomes' greatness.
Could, possibly, the time for all that mobility come from the middle of their respective lines not allowing some mammoth DT to run through almost unchecked, if not also stepping on the QB's foot?
I bring this up due to the stunning number of times I saw Erin lauded for his mobility, but he also had countless plays where he had 5-6 seconds untouched before he really even had to react. Nothing makes a QB look great like actually having those couple of clean seconds to make reads/decisions...and Minnesota has NOT given their QBs that for many years, now.
Not saying our OL doesn't break down. It does. Just that it all works together. If Cousins were more mobile, the line would look better than they are. And if the line were better, Cousins would look better than he is.
This, a million times this!
Unfortunately you can't have a middle of the road opinion on the matter, you have to either be Kirk is HOF or a complete POS QB.
Quote: @"medaille" said:
Our OLine lets defenders get into the backfield uncontested
far too often. Period. They blow up the play before Cousins can
really react. Would an ultra mobile QB
help the OLine out? Most likely. Would an average athlete at QB that scrambles
more make a difference? I don’t think
so. Would the ultra mobile QB also be a
worse passer than Cousins? Probably. Cousins is who he is at this point. We’ve all known that he needs to have a
better interior OLine in front of him, and he’s not getting it despite us
investing a fair number of draft picks over time.
Imo kirks issue is he sets up and rarely moves from the spot. You don't have to be a mobile QB to move the pocket or move in the pocket to make the defenders adjust the rush lines. With Kirk you almost always know exactly where he's going to be. I think those little slide steps you see guys like Brady make are what makes a difference for a pocket passer and really helps out an OL.
Quote: @"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"AGRforever" said:
@"Vanguard83" said:
KC isnt the problem. Put a defense that gets after people out there, and we will get to the SB. Last year was an amazing run, but we all knew our D was hot garbage.
It doesn’t even have to be a top D. Just average.
Definitely, we need defensive improvement, but here's a couple of realities...not opinions:
1. Both KC and Philly had top-5 offensive lines last season.
2. Our QB was the most-hit in the league (and he's typical among the most hit).
Kirk has been pummeled since he got to Minnesota, as have most of our QBs for over a decade. We finally have goot OTs, but we really need Bradbury and Ingram to step WAY up this season.
Both Philly and KC have ultra mobile QBs. Think about it. How many times do you see Mahomes escaping pressure and throwing a TD. A lot. But the narrative is never about the failure on the OL, is it? It's about Mahomes' greatness.
Could, possibly, the time for all that mobility come from the middle of their respective lines not allowing some mammoth DT to run through almost unchecked, if not also stepping on the QB's foot?
I bring this up due to the stunning number of times I saw Erin lauded for his mobility, but he also had countless plays where he had 5-6 seconds untouched before he really even had to react. Nothing makes a QB look great like actually having those couple of clean seconds to make reads/decisions...and Minnesota has NOT given their QBs that for many years, now.
Not saying our OL doesn't break down. It does. Just that it all works together. If Cousins were more mobile, the line would look better than they are. And if the line were better, Cousins would look better than he is.
Fair, to a point...but Ingram was rated at the bottom for playing down at that level, just ask Kirk's right foot.
Similarly, the line was rated in the near-basement for the last decade, barring one season with Shurmur as OC. The pattern holds.
Yes, Kirk could be more mobile, but I've seen the "WE HAVE TO HAVE A MORE MOBILE QB AND WE'LL WIN THE SUPERBOWL" froth since dog-killer Vick was great at highlight reels, but not at winning much that mattered. McFlabb did make it to the dance...once.
I don't know if Cousins will ever be in the HOF, I've never called him the best ever, please stow all that extremist BS. The fact is, however, our interior o-line has been seen as junk because it's played like junk. Could a more mobile QB evade pressure better? Sure, to an extent...but, does that solve everything?
Ask Russell Wilson.
Quote: @"Zanary" said:
@"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"MaroonBells" said:
@"Zanary" said:
@"AGRforever" said:
@"Vanguard83" said:
KC isnt the problem. Put a defense that gets after people out there, and we will get to the SB. Last year was an amazing run, but we all knew our D was hot garbage.
It doesn’t even have to be a top D. Just average.
Definitely, we need defensive improvement, but here's a couple of realities...not opinions:
1. Both KC and Philly had top-5 offensive lines last season.
2. Our QB was the most-hit in the league (and he's typical among the most hit).
Kirk has been pummeled since he got to Minnesota, as have most of our QBs for over a decade. We finally have goot OTs, but we really need Bradbury and Ingram to step WAY up this season.
Both Philly and KC have ultra mobile QBs. Think about it. How many times do you see Mahomes escaping pressure and throwing a TD. A lot. But the narrative is never about the failure on the OL, is it? It's about Mahomes' greatness.
Could, possibly, the time for all that mobility come from the middle of their respective lines not allowing some mammoth DT to run through almost unchecked, if not also stepping on the QB's foot?
I bring this up due to the stunning number of times I saw Erin lauded for his mobility, but he also had countless plays where he had 5-6 seconds untouched before he really even had to react. Nothing makes a QB look great like actually having those couple of clean seconds to make reads/decisions...and Minnesota has NOT given their QBs that for many years, now.
Not saying our OL doesn't break down. It does. Just that it all works together. If Cousins were more mobile, the line would look better than they are. And if the line were better, Cousins would look better than he is.
Fair, to a point...but Ingram was rated at the bottom for playing down at that level, just ask Kirk's right foot.
Similarly, the line was rated in the near-basement for the last decade, barring one season with Shurmur as OC. The pattern holds.
Yes, Kirk could be more mobile, but I've seen the "WE HAVE TO HAVE A MORE MOBILE QB AND WE'LL WIN THE SUPERBOWL" froth since dog-killer Vick was great at highlight reels, but not at winning much that mattered. McFlabb did make it to the dance...once.
I don't know if Cousins will ever be in the HOF, I've never called him the best ever, please stow all that extremist BS. The fact is, however, our interior o-line has been seen as junk because it's played like junk. Could a more mobile QB evade pressure better? Sure, to an extent...but, does that solve everything?
Ask Russell Wilson.
Kirk is not yet a hall of fame QB. He is, however, one of the best QBs in the game today. No, we don't need a runner under center to win a Super Bowl. But better mobility in the pocket would help him, as would better IOL performance. At this point, we're more likely to get the latter.
It's pretty obvious 2023 is Kirk's pivotal season. He returns to the same offense and play caller for the first time in 7 seasons. This should result is quicker decision-making. The offensive line FINALLY returns not only all five starters but all of its depth too. The talent on the line is there; it's just a matter of putting it all together. I think it happens to some extent this year.
Now....about that defense....
Precisely.
Finally a returning OC and system, the line returns, which is hopefully(?!) a positive...and the new DC has plenty of cred, and lots of hungry young legs to work with, but the league gives so little time in the offseason, nowadays...I'm tempering my expectations for the first chunk of the season.
The defense has outright sucked for 2 straight years. Just fucking brutal. Cousins was the most hit QB in the NFL last year. I seriously don't get how anyone that is consistently critical of Cousins doesn't factor that in. The only conclusion is an agenda. I know he isn't perfect, but let's get real about it.
Quote: @"StickyBun" said:
The defense has outright sucked for 2 straight years. Just fucking brutal. Cousins was the most hit QB in the NFL last year. I seriously don't get how anyone that is consistently critical of Cousins doesn't factor that in. The only conclusion is an agenda. I know he isn't perfect, but let's get real about it.
Regarding Cousins and our defense, I thought this was a pretty interesting stat.
QBs with the most wins the last 2 seasons (and their defensive points per game allowed ranking).
1. Patrick Mahomes (12th)2. Josh Allen (2nd)3. Jalen Hurts (11th)4. Joe Burrow (6th)5. Kirk Cousins (28th)6. Aaron Rodgers (13th)
How quickly we forget all the come-backs last year - by the offense.
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