Quote: @greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
Because he will be a UFA and with the cap frozen and reverted back to 2018 levels it means that the UFA salary cap dollars aren't there.
Barr can say whatever he wants, My guess is, if he is released his new team contract won't be 15 Mil a year. \
And with the Salary Cap Frozen in 2022, he'll probably only get a 1 year "prove it " deal in 2021 and 2022.
With things as they are how does Barr have any leverage.
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit. This ^
Barr and Harry are the two pieces Zim uses to setup his D. I think it is short sighted to say they can see that his play isn't worth the cost. In reality, nobody in the NFL is. But Barr took less to stay with the Vikings and be used as Zim sees fit. It means he is paid less and gets less glory stats. How can that not be worth sooo much in today's NFL? We complain about Divas and glory hounds, but then complain because someone isn't
One can't look at our D last year and say Barr wasn't missed. Was it worth 15 mil? No, but was cousins worth 33 mill (or whatever his insane cap is) but where would be without him. Well, that was the D without Barr, and yes several other pieces, but Barr was the well established and consistent piece that the D was missing.
Quote: @greediron said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit. This ^
Barr and Harry are the two pieces Zim uses to setup his D. I think it is short sighted to say they can see that his play isn't worth the cost. In reality, nobody in the NFL is. But Barr took less to stay with the Vikings and be used as Zim sees fit. It means he is paid less and gets less glory stats. How can that not be worth sooo much in today's NFL? We complain about Divas and glory hounds, but then complain because someone isn't
One can't look at our D last year and say Barr wasn't missed. Was it worth 15 mil? No, but was cousins worth 33 mill (or whatever his insane cap is) but where would be without him. Well, that was the D without Barr, and yes several other pieces, but Barr was the well established and consistent piece that the D was missing.
I cants say that, our D was lacking because we had no DTs that could eat blocks, Barrs best years were when LJ was eating those double teams allowing Barr to be one on one with the RB in the hole, but then again most LB should be able to win against a RB, and be able to slip blocks and make plays, which IMO is where Barr is lacking. if he cant use his speed he is done.
Harry does get moved all over and is asked to do things to help the team, but he at least still shows up on tape. Barr for the most part is invisible if he isnt allowed a free run.
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
Agree. There are ways they can reduce his cap hit without cutting his pay.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
Jimmy, curious if there's anyone on the roster you'd like to keep.
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
His role isn't the type that is going to stuff the stat sheet. It shows up on the film and opposing coaches see/feel it. Its why the coaches/players have voted him to the pro bowl 4 times. Back to my original point, he isn't wort the $15M cap hit, but it isn't far off.
if he is impacting a game that would show up on a stat sheet in some way. if he isnt impacting a game why would opposing coaches game plan for him? wouldnt we see examples of his greatness flash from time to time? we play against other teams with "studs" that are game planned for and those guys still end up making an impact against our teams, why cant we expect the same from our top money LB?
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
Jimmy, curious if there's anyone on the roster you'd like to keep.
depends on the scenario... are we rebuilding or are we going to keep settling for mediocrity? besides cousins and barr, who else have I been vocal about moving on from?
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
Jimmy, curious if there's anyone on the roster you'd like to keep.
depends on the scenario... are we rebuilding or are we going to keep settling for mediocrity? besides cousins and barr, who else have I been vocal about moving on from?
Mediocrity. Dalvin. Hunter.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
Jimmy, curious if there's anyone on the roster you'd like to keep.
depends on the scenario... are we rebuilding or are we going to keep settling for mediocrity? besides cousins and barr, who else have I been vocal about moving on from?
Mediocrity. Dalvin. Hunter.
I asked about Hunters health and desire to want a new deal before proving his health, hardly saying move on from him.
Dalvin is a move on from only if the team is going to rebuild as he wont be worth a shit in 2-3 years when the team is ready to contend again.
IMO this team is more than 2 years away from contending for a SB and keeping aging players that could be draft picks on high salaries is a mistake instead of using that money to find and retain younger free agents that will still be viable in 2-3 years would be a better use of our current cap and the draft picks to load the cupboard for a real run.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ AGRforever said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
Why would he restructure? Didn't he just sign for less to stay with the Vikings?
and his play showed it....
I used to defend him as the straw that stirred Zimmers drink, but I just cant any more. He is a good not great coverage guy, he is weak in run support in the middle, decent on the edge, and a disappointment as a pass rusher in terms of getting off blocks.
I am done with Barr and wish the team could be as well, but IIRC his contract makes it hard to force anything except maybe a trade.
Yup, its time to let Barr walk. He's hardly the player we're paying him to be.
Is Barr worth $15M? No. But the cap his is based on how the Vikings structured the contract. He is worth close to the $12.3M is he actually owed in 2021. People seem to think that Barr is supposed to be Vonn Miller which isn't his role at all. Nobody notices it but Barr is probably the Vikings best run defender and dictates how the opposing offense sets their protections. Zimmer loves Barr because Barr forces offenses to do what Zimmer wants them to do. That is worth a lot of money.
This is Barr's camp setting the expectation they won't restructure. This isn't suggesting the Vikings have asked him to take a pay-cut, yet. They can move money around if they want to keep him and lower the cap hit.
I dont see it, I dont see Barrs big influence on the opposing run game. IMO our DTs better our biggest keys to stopping the opposing offenses inside runs, which is where we get gashed the most in recent years. Like I said, Barr does a damn good job IMO on outside runs and shit in the flat, but is easily blocked and as such not a big threat to opponents power running games.
I just am done defending a guy that doesnt show up statistically at a position that should be able to be pointed to as a game changer from a statistical standpoint.
His average per year makes him the 7th highest paid linebacker in the league ( 3 million more per year than Kendricks)... I just dont see it.
Jimmy, curious if there's anyone on the roster you'd like to keep.
depends on the scenario... are we rebuilding or are we going to keep settling for mediocrity? besides cousins and barr, who else have I been vocal about moving on from?
Mediocrity. Dalvin. Hunter.
I asked about Hunters health and desire to want a new deal before proving his health, hardly saying move on from him.
Dalvin is a move on from only if the team is going to rebuild as he wont be worth a shit in 2-3 years when the team is ready to contend again.
IMO this team is more than 2 years away from contending for a SB and keeping aging players that could be draft picks on high salaries is a mistake instead of using that money to find and retain younger free agents that will still be viable in 2-3 years would be a better use of our current cap and the draft picks to load the cupboard for a real run.
Curious what you think the odds would be for us to land on upgrades at each of those positions in a blow it all up scenario.
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