Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@"FSUVike" said:
That's the thing, though. Other than NE or Pittsburgh how many teams are actually consistently good year in and year out?
It's pretty normal for a chunk of the previous years' Playoff Teams to not make it back the next.
From NFCCG to missing the Playoffs to back in it seems like a standard thing to expect in the NFL.
Geoff keeps saying this but I'm not sure folks are listening: the team under-performed to their talent. Many factors including a bad fit at OC and crappy O-Line and clubhouse leader on Defense actually having a mental breakdown. Zimmer overcomplicating his D scheme for half the year. Tony's replacements being in over their head.
If Stefanski can't cut it Kubiak is in the wings. Line will hopefully improve via the Draft. Griff recovered but also has a successor pushing him. The D righted the ship for the most part during the 2nd half of the season. Dennison is a proven O-Line Coach.
If Rick and Mike don't make it work this year they're gone. But the talent is good enough that all they really need to do is not F it up.
I'll go on record right now and predict Minnesota gets back to the NFCCG next year. And gets annihilated. Again. Cuz that's what the scriptwriters want for this franchise.
Preach it. The Vikings got caught up in their own success from 2017, made the flashy FA move add Cousins, and were coming off a season as the leagues #1 defense. But they lacked the ability to handle success. Some of that is the players, some of that is the coaches, the schedule also had a lot to do with it. At the end of the day everyone was to blame.
But although there is always a sour taste in everyone's mouth from 2018 this is still one of the better rosters in the NFC. People tend to over-correct on their opinions after a poor season. Albeit there are some questions they still have a top 10 defense, a pro bowl RB when healthy, and two pro bowl WR's.
I'll go with your general premise of having the potential to perform better than in 2018, but on one of your points --
"a pro bowl RB when healthy"
-- you're mixing potential into the story when every other element is someone who has proven NFL production. Cook has played 15 games and has 969 rushing yards, 1364 total yards, and 2 100+ games. Injuries, bad offensive coordinator, weak line - sure, those were factors. But he's rarely been a significant factor and is still just unproven potential. Up to this point, he's no better than the 7th-best RB drafted in 2017, after Hunt, Mixon, Kamara, McCaffrey, Conner, and Fournette (maybe 8th if you consider Tarik Cohen a RB).
Vikings have been counting on Cook for 2 years and IMO he's still a huge and incredibly critical question mark for 2019. No Latavius Murray safety net this year either.
Quote: @"Jor-El" said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@"FSUVike" said:
That's the thing, though. Other than NE or Pittsburgh how many teams are actually consistently good year in and year out?
It's pretty normal for a chunk of the previous years' Playoff Teams to not make it back the next.
From NFCCG to missing the Playoffs to back in it seems like a standard thing to expect in the NFL.
Geoff keeps saying this but I'm not sure folks are listening: the team under-performed to their talent. Many factors including a bad fit at OC and crappy O-Line and clubhouse leader on Defense actually having a mental breakdown. Zimmer overcomplicating his D scheme for half the year. Tony's replacements being in over their head.
If Stefanski can't cut it Kubiak is in the wings. Line will hopefully improve via the Draft. Griff recovered but also has a successor pushing him. The D righted the ship for the most part during the 2nd half of the season. Dennison is a proven O-Line Coach.
If Rick and Mike don't make it work this year they're gone. But the talent is good enough that all they really need to do is not F it up.
I'll go on record right now and predict Minnesota gets back to the NFCCG next year. And gets annihilated. Again. Cuz that's what the scriptwriters want for this franchise.
Preach it. The Vikings got caught up in their own success from 2017, made the flashy FA move add Cousins, and were coming off a season as the leagues #1 defense. But they lacked the ability to handle success. Some of that is the players, some of that is the coaches, the schedule also had a lot to do with it. At the end of the day everyone was to blame.
But although there is always a sour taste in everyone's mouth from 2018 this is still one of the better rosters in the NFC. People tend to over-correct on their opinions after a poor season. Albeit there are some questions they still have a top 10 defense, a pro bowl RB when healthy, and two pro bowl WR's.
I'll go with your general premise of having the potential to perform better than in 2018, but on one of your points --
"a pro bowl RB when healthy"
-- you're mixing potential into the story when every other element is someone who has proven NFL production. Cook has played 15 games and has 969 rushing yards, 1364 total yards, and 2 100+ games. Injuries, bad offensive coordinator, weak line - sure, those were factors. But he's rarely been a significant factor and is still just unproven potential. Up to this point, he's no better than the 7th-best RB drafted in 2017, after Hunt, Mixon, Kamara, McCaffrey, Conner, and Fournette (maybe 8th if you consider Tarik Cohen a RB).
Vikings have been counting on Cook for 2 years and IMO he's still a huge and incredibly critical question mark for 2019. No Latavius Murray safety net this year either.
The only question mark about Cook is his ability to stay healthy. It's pretty obvious he's a top-level talent in the games he's played healthy.
Quote: @"MaroonBells" said:
@"Jor-El" said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@"FSUVike" said:
That's the thing, though. Other than NE or Pittsburgh how many teams are actually consistently good year in and year out?
It's pretty normal for a chunk of the previous years' Playoff Teams to not make it back the next.
From NFCCG to missing the Playoffs to back in it seems like a standard thing to expect in the NFL.
Geoff keeps saying this but I'm not sure folks are listening: the team under-performed to their talent. Many factors including a bad fit at OC and crappy O-Line and clubhouse leader on Defense actually having a mental breakdown. Zimmer overcomplicating his D scheme for half the year. Tony's replacements being in over their head.
If Stefanski can't cut it Kubiak is in the wings. Line will hopefully improve via the Draft. Griff recovered but also has a successor pushing him. The D righted the ship for the most part during the 2nd half of the season. Dennison is a proven O-Line Coach.
If Rick and Mike don't make it work this year they're gone. But the talent is good enough that all they really need to do is not F it up.
I'll go on record right now and predict Minnesota gets back to the NFCCG next year. And gets annihilated. Again. Cuz that's what the scriptwriters want for this franchise.
Preach it. The Vikings got caught up in their own success from 2017, made the flashy FA move add Cousins, and were coming off a season as the leagues #1 defense. But they lacked the ability to handle success. Some of that is the players, some of that is the coaches, the schedule also had a lot to do with it. At the end of the day everyone was to blame.
But although there is always a sour taste in everyone's mouth from 2018 this is still one of the better rosters in the NFC. People tend to over-correct on their opinions after a poor season. Albeit there are some questions they still have a top 10 defense, a pro bowl RB when healthy, and two pro bowl WR's.
I'll go with your general premise of having the potential to perform better than in 2018, but on one of your points --
"a pro bowl RB when healthy"
-- you're mixing potential into the story when every other element is someone who has proven NFL production. Cook has played 15 games and has 969 rushing yards, 1364 total yards, and 2 100+ games. Injuries, bad offensive coordinator, weak line - sure, those were factors. But he's rarely been a significant factor and is still just unproven potential. Up to this point, he's no better than the 7th-best RB drafted in 2017, after Hunt, Mixon, Kamara, McCaffrey, Conner, and Fournette (maybe 8th if you consider Tarik Cohen a RB).
Vikings have been counting on Cook for 2 years and IMO he's still a huge and incredibly critical question mark for 2019. No Latavius Murray safety net this year either.
The only question mark about Cook is his ability to stay healthy. It's pretty obvious he's a top-level talent in the games he's played healthy.
IDK...wasn't he fully healthy after October? 517 yards in the last 8 games -that's pretty good, would be just over 1,000 for a full season. But I wouldn't call it top-level. Maybe above-average, but he always looked like he was close to breaking a big gain but didn't quite do it. Still recovering? Let's hope so.
Still recovering but more importantly, in desperate need of an effective offensive line and scheme.
I warned you all before the draft, better player than Warrick.Dunn by a good bit but always dinged up. I'd honestly get him a running mate like the Falcons have with Freeman and Coleman.
Quote: @"Jor-El" said:
IDK...wasn't he fully healthy after October? 517 yards in the last 8 games -that's pretty good, would be just over 1,000 for a full season. But I wouldn't call it top-level. Maybe above-average, but he always looked like he was close to breaking a big gain but didn't quite do it. Still recovering? Let's hope so.
In that span, he wasn't given very many rushing opportunities though... in 6 out of those 8 games he had 13 or less rushing attempts.
If you want a better barometer for his talent... last season when Cook touched the ball 17+ times per game, he averaged 111 scrimmage yards.
In 2017, he played in 4 games before he tore his ACL and had two 100+ yard scrimmage games and was well on his way to 100+ against Detroit before he got hurt.
It's perfectly fine to have doubts about his ability to stay healthy and play a full 16 games... THAT is a legit argument. But his on-the-field production would put him near the top of the league if he played a full season.
Quote: @"Wetlander" said:
@"Jor-El" said:
IDK...wasn't he fully healthy after October? 517 yards in the last 8 games -that's pretty good, would be just over 1,000 for a full season. But I wouldn't call it top-level. Maybe above-average, but he always looked like he was close to breaking a big gain but didn't quite do it. Still recovering? Let's hope so.
In that span, he wasn't given very many rushing opportunities though... in 6 out of those 8 games he had 13 or less rushing attempts.
If you want a better barometer for his talent... last season when Cook touched the ball 17+ times per game, he averaged 111 scrimmage yards.
In 2017, he played in 4 games before he tore his ACL and had two 100+ yard scrimmage games and was well on his way to 100+ against Detroit before he got hurt.
It's perfectly fine to have doubts about his ability to stay healthy and play a full 16 games... THAT is a legit argument. But his on-the-field production would put him near the top of the league if he played a full season.
Yeah, I don't get the argument that we don't know what kind of talent he is. We have eyes. He's a very talented runner and receiver. He's actually a pretty decent blocker too.
If he can stay healthy on a team almost "angrily" committed to the run, in an outside zone designed by a man who turned a half dozen schmucks into stars, I like his chances.
Quote: @"MaroonBells" said:
@"Wetlander" said:
@"Jor-El" said:
IDK...wasn't he fully healthy after October? 517 yards in the last 8 games -that's pretty good, would be just over 1,000 for a full season. But I wouldn't call it top-level. Maybe above-average, but he always looked like he was close to breaking a big gain but didn't quite do it. Still recovering? Let's hope so.
In that span, he wasn't given very many rushing opportunities though... in 6 out of those 8 games he had 13 or less rushing attempts.
If you want a better barometer for his talent... last season when Cook touched the ball 17+ times per game, he averaged 111 scrimmage yards.
In 2017, he played in 4 games before he tore his ACL and had two 100+ yard scrimmage games and was well on his way to 100+ against Detroit before he got hurt.
It's perfectly fine to have doubts about his ability to stay healthy and play a full 16 games... THAT is a legit argument. But his on-the-field production would put him near the top of the league if he played a full season.
Yeah, I don't get the argument that we don't know what kind of talent he is. We have eyes. He's a very talented runner and receiver. He's actually a pretty decent blocker too.
If he can stay healthy on a team almost "angrily" committed to the run, in an outside zone designed by a man who turned a half dozen schmucks into stars, I like his chances.
There are some individuals on the Vikings coaching staff that would tell you Cook is the most talented player on the offense. Those aren't my words and say a lot when you have so many offensive weapons. Last season the Patriots were raving about Cook going into the MN game as well so that is maybe a more unbiased opinion.
100% agree that you can argue his durability. But the talent is undeniable.
Maybe they see what potential is there if we solve the oline issue---frees him up to run or catch or freeze a D a little more in all situations
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