Quote: @purplefaithful said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
Wilfs finally woke up from the delusion that Rick is a great g.m. and rid themselves of the problem. Bravo!
Belichick last 9 drafts: 1 Pro Bowl season, 1 AllPro season, 6 top 100 picks out of football
Spielman last 9 drafts: 23 Pro Bowl seasons. 12 AllPro seasons, 2 top 100 picks out of football, both off-field issues
There's more to being a GM than the draft. So if you want to compare free agency and trade results, Mohamed Sanu and I are ready for that too.
And the reply from many will be who's in the playoffs and who's not?
But - that data comparison sure shines a light on Coaching as a problem, not the talent on the field.
Yup, thx for making me even more uneasy about RS leaving. Just as I was finding some peace in it.
Well that's me: Mr. Pessimist. Ha.
We all want what's best for the Vikings. I think it's possible a shake up could be a good thing. I was hoping for a shake up just at the coaching level, but something, somewhere changed all that. I'd blame the Cronins and the Souhans and the Zulgads, but I doubt the WILVES are stupid enough to listen to that collection of dipshits.
My biggest problem is that so many Viking fans and media lack context. They genuinely don't understand anything but wins and losses. They don't follow the draft, so they don't understand how it works. Case in point: just read a tweet criticizing Spielman for the fact that only "14 of his last 47 draft picks" are still with the Vikings. HORRIBLE, said the poster!...until someone reminded him that this ranked 6th in the NFL.
Vikings have been one of the best--I'd argue THE best--drafting team in the NFL. Did Spielman make a few free agency and trade mistakes? Yup, but look around......seriously, look around.....
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
Wilfs finally woke up from the delusion that Rick is a great g.m. and rid themselves of the problem. Bravo!
Belichick last 9 drafts: 1 Pro Bowl season, 1 AllPro season, 6 top 100 picks out of football
Spielman last 9 drafts: 23 Pro Bowl seasons. 12 AllPro seasons, 2 top 100 picks out of football, both off-field issues
There's more to being a GM than the draft. So if you want to compare free agency and trade results, Mohamed Sanu and I are ready for that too.
And the reply from many will be who's in the playoffs and who's not?
But - that data comparison sure shines a light on Coaching as a problem, not the talent on the field.
Yup, thx for making me even more uneasy about RS leaving. Just as I was finding some peace in it.
Well that's me: Mr. Pessimist. Ha.
We all want what's best for the Vikings. I think it's possible a shake up could be a good thing. I was hoping for a shake up just at the coaching level, but something, somewhere changed all that. I'd blame the Cronins and the Souhans and the Zulgads, but I doubt the WILVES are stupid enough to listen to that collection of dipshits.
My biggest problem is that so many Viking fans and media lack context. They genuinely don't understand anything but wins and losses. They don't follow the draft, so they don't understand how it works. Case in point: just read a tweet criticizing Spielman for the fact that only "14 of his last 47 draft picks" are still with the Vikings. HORRIBLE, said the poster!...until someone reminded him that this ranked 6th in the NFL.
Vikings have been one of the best--I'd argue THE best--drafting team in the NFL. Did Spielman make a few free agency and trade mistakes? Yup, but look around......seriously, look around.....
That's all well and good.... and you make good points, MB. But the bottom line is wins, playoffs and Superbowls. None of which the Vikings are particularly good at. If the point is that 'good things are happening and eventually a breakthrough will happen' just hasn't happened for Minnesota. I guarantee you that as amazing and fun as the Minneapolis Miracle was, you can look at it conversely as they were a freaking frog's hair away from being one and done after a somewhat magical regular season. THAT is way more on brand for Minnesota than the Minneapolis Miracle.
There's WAY more of a case to keep Spielman than Zimmer undoubtedly. But to endeavor to get to a better place, the house needed to be cleaned for both positions. No doubt Viking's fans lack context, but so do all fanbases. I could list some very ugly stats about how grotesque the Viking's playoff record and appearances have been with what is usually an at least moderate level of success during the regular season. They underperform consistently in the playoffs. It's maddening.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
Wilfs finally woke up from the delusion that Rick is a great g.m. and rid themselves of the problem. Bravo!
Belichick last 9 drafts: 1 Pro Bowl season, 1 AllPro season, 6 top 100 picks out of football
Spielman last 9 drafts: 23 Pro Bowl seasons. 12 AllPro seasons, 2 top 100 picks out of football, both off-field issues
There's more to being a GM than the draft. So if you want to compare free agency and trade results, Mohamed Sanu and I are ready for that too.
And the reply from many will be who's in the playoffs and who's not?
But - that data comparison sure shines a light on Coaching as a problem, not the talent on the field.
Yup, thx for making me even more uneasy about RS leaving. Just as I was finding some peace in it.
Well that's me: Mr. Pessimist. Ha.
We all want what's best for the Vikings. I think it's possible a shake up could be a good thing. I was hoping for a shake up just at the coaching level, but something, somewhere changed all that. I'd blame the Cronins and the Souhans and the Zulgads, but I doubt the WILVES are stupid enough to listen to that collection of dipshits.
My biggest problem is that so many Viking fans and media lack context. They genuinely don't understand anything but wins and losses. They don't follow the draft, so they don't understand how it works. Case in point: just read a tweet criticizing Spielman for the fact that only "14 of his last 47 draft picks" are still with the Vikings. HORRIBLE, said the poster!...until someone reminded him that this ranked 6th in the NFL.
Vikings have been one of the best--I'd argue THE best--drafting team in the NFL. Did Spielman make a few free agency and trade mistakes? Yup, but look around......seriously, look around.....
That's all well and good.... and you make good points, MB. But the bottom line is wins, playoffs and Superbowls. None of which the Vikings are particularly good at. If the point is that 'good things are happening and eventually a breakthrough will happen' just hasn't happened for Minnesota. I guarantee you that as amazing and fun as the Minneapolis Miracle was, you can look at it conversely as they were a freaking frog's hair away from being one and done after a somewhat magical regular season. THAT is way more on brand for Minnesota than the Minneapolis Miracle.
There's WAY more of a case to keep Spielman than Zimmer undoubtedly. But to endeavor to get to a better place, the house needed to be cleaned for both positions. No doubt Viking's fans lack context, but so do all fanbases. I could list some very ugly stats about how grotesque the Viking's playoff record and appearances have been with what is usually an at least moderate level of success during the regular season. They underperform consistently in the playoffs. It's maddening.
I’m just a big believer in fully informed decision making. Not making decisions based on surface results, but looking deeper, looking at the “why” behind those results. You can’t make a good decision about anything—college football players, coaches, GMs, stocks, employees—without looking behind the numbers.
When we scout a player in the draft, do you think all we look at are his numbers? His wins and losses? Of course not. One of my favorite examples of this is Stefon Diggs. If you went by just his numbers at Maryland he probably shouldn’t have been drafted at all. But if you look deeper, you see not only was he hurt for much of his time there, but his QB was terrible. Does that spell potential upside? Value? You bet it does.
If you look at what happened this year, and in the season you mention above, to me it’s clear that the biggest problem was the Vikings head coach and his inability to prepare his team either strategically or emotionally and get them to play at a high level for 60 minutes. It sure as hell wasn’t the talent on the roster. In fact, it was Zimmer’s failure to win with what was, arguably, a very talented roster, that made his shortcomings all the more obvious.
It’s ironic that many people who wanted Spielman fired also agree that the Vikings are considered the best open situation in the NFL. Why? Because of the talent on their roster...constructed by the GM…whom they wanted fired.
I suspect there’s truth to the speculation that putting Spielman in a figurehead role over the new regime was not a viable situation for either him or the new regime and that’s why he was let go. And that’s fine; I get that. But to argue that he wasn’t good at what he did, especially when it comes to the DRAFT….is just ridiculous.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
Wilfs finally woke up from the delusion that Rick is a great g.m. and rid themselves of the problem. Bravo!
Belichick last 9 drafts: 1 Pro Bowl season, 1 AllPro season, 6 top 100 picks out of football
Spielman last 9 drafts: 23 Pro Bowl seasons. 12 AllPro seasons, 2 top 100 picks out of football, both off-field issues
There's more to being a GM than the draft. So if you want to compare free agency and trade results, Mohamed Sanu and I are ready for that too.
And the reply from many will be who's in the playoffs and who's not?
But - that data comparison sure shines a light on Coaching as a problem, not the talent on the field.
Yup, thx for making me even more uneasy about RS leaving. Just as I was finding some peace in it.
Well that's me: Mr. Pessimist. Ha.
We all want what's best for the Vikings. I think it's possible a shake up could be a good thing. I was hoping for a shake up just at the coaching level, but something, somewhere changed all that. I'd blame the Cronins and the Souhans and the Zulgads, but I doubt the WILVES are stupid enough to listen to that collection of dipshits.
My biggest problem is that so many Viking fans and media lack context. They genuinely don't understand anything but wins and losses. They don't follow the draft, so they don't understand how it works. Case in point: just read a tweet criticizing Spielman for the fact that only "14 of his last 47 draft picks" are still with the Vikings. HORRIBLE, said the poster!...until someone reminded him that this ranked 6th in the NFL.
Vikings have been one of the best--I'd argue THE best--drafting team in the NFL. Did Spielman make a few free agency and trade mistakes? Yup, but look around......seriously, look around.....
That's all well and good.... and you make good points, MB. But the bottom line is wins, playoffs and Superbowls. None of which the Vikings are particularly good at. If the point is that 'good things are happening and eventually a breakthrough will happen' just hasn't happened for Minnesota. I guarantee you that as amazing and fun as the Minneapolis Miracle was, you can look at it conversely as they were a freaking frog's hair away from being one and done after a somewhat magical regular season. THAT is way more on brand for Minnesota than the Minneapolis Miracle.
There's WAY more of a case to keep Spielman than Zimmer undoubtedly. But to endeavor to get to a better place, the house needed to be cleaned for both positions. No doubt Viking's fans lack context, but so do all fanbases. I could list some very ugly stats about how grotesque the Viking's playoff record and appearances have been with what is usually an at least moderate level of success during the regular season. They underperform consistently in the playoffs. It's maddening.
I’m just a big believer in fully informed decision making. Not making decisions based on surface results, but looking deeper, looking at the “why” behind those results. You can’t make a good decision about anything—college football players, coaches, GMs, stocks, employees—without looking behind the numbers.
When we scout a player in the draft, do you think all we look at are his numbers? His wins and losses? Of course not. One of my favorite examples of this is Stefon Diggs. If you went by just his numbers at Maryland he probably shouldn’t have been drafted at all. But if you look deeper, you see not only was he hurt for much of his time there, but his QB was terrible. Does that spell potential upside? Value? You bet it does.
If you look at what happened this year, and in the season you mention above, to me it’s clear that the biggest problem was the Vikings head coach and his inability to prepare his team either strategically or emotionally and get them to play at a high level for 60 minutes. It sure as hell wasn’t the talent on the roster. In fact, it was Zimmer’s failure to win with what was, arguably, a very talented roster, that made his shortcomings all the more obvious.
It’s ironic that many people who wanted Spielman fired also agree that the Vikings are considered the best open situation in the NFL. Why? Because of the talent on their roster...constructed by the GM…whom they wanted fired.
I suspect there’s truth to the speculation that putting Spielman in a figurehead role over the new regime was not a viable situation for either him or the new regime and that’s why he was let go. And that’s fine; I get that. But to argue that he wasn’t good at what he did, especially when it comes to the DRAFT….is just ridiculous.
Some folks don't remember the days of Denny and Solly rearranging the draft board.
I do. I know you do. Definitely top 5-8 drafting.
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