I don't know if Sloter is the answer for #2. However after last pre season I wasn't convinced Siemian was either. I thought Sloter did out play him. If it was his lack if experience. What did Siemian show that his experience made a difference. His mediocre stats in pre season pretty much mirrored his short career. He won't be that hard to replace.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
Two years in the same system...if he isn't better than Mannion right now he shouldn't be in the building.
No doubt.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
Two years in the same system...if he isn't better than Mannion right now he shouldn't be in the building.
Not really true... the Vikings poached him after final cuts just prior to the start of the 2017 season. He had to learn Shurmur's offense that year without the benefit of OTA's and Training Camp because he was in Denver at the time. Then you factor in that the 3rd QB doesn't get many practice reps during the regular season and he likely didn't have much of a chance to prove himself that first year.
Next thing you know... Shurmur leaves to be a HC and we hire DeFelippo to be our new OC in 2018. He's only had one full offseason with the team and had to learn 3 different offenses in 2 seasons (Denver's, Shurmur's, and DeFlip's). I'm not making excuses for the guy, but let's not pretend like he's had a couple years in the same system because he hasn't.
I would much rather take a chance on a guy absolutely ripping it up against 3rd stringers two years in a row than take a chance on a guy looking terrible against 2nd stringers.
Quote: @purpleloki said:
I seem to remember Zim not being happy with Sloter in the pre season. I believe he said, "Yeah he plays well in the game but he needs to work in practice". Something like that.
and I seem to remember Zim not being happy with Barrs effort at times.... but he sure didnt want to move on without him when push came to shove. I am really starting to not bother listening to what Zimmer says because its never really what he is going to do anyway. either way... 1 looked good against the comptetion he faced... the other didnt, wouldnt it make the most sense to increase the level of competition for the one that looks good (and at the same time the level of the suppotring cast) and see if that player still shows good?
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@"BarrNone55" said:
Two years in the same system...if he isn't better than Mannion right now he shouldn't be in the building.
Not really true... the Vikings poached him after final cuts just prior to the start of the 2017 season. He had to learn Shurmur's offense that year without the benefit of OTA's and Training Camp because he was in Denver at the time. Then you factor in that the 3rd QB doesn't get many practice reps during the regular season and he likely didn't have much of a chance to prove himself that first year.
Next thing you know... Shurmur leaves to be a HC and we hire DeFelippo to be our new OC in 2018. He's only had one full offseason with the team and had to learn 3 different offenses in 2 seasons (Denver's, Shurmur's, and DeFlip's). I'm not making excuses for the guy, but let's not pretend like he's had a couple years in the same system because he hasn't.
actually I have heard it mentioned quite a few times that the 3rd string QB actually gets more reps during the season because he runs the scout offenses... they arent reps in our teams offense, but he is getting to face one of the better Ds in the league as they perfect their new tricks and such. Sloter would actually see less snaps as the #2, but he would be working with our actual offense which would be the next logical step in his training progression.
Quote: @jargomcfargo said:
@ greediron said:
@ SFVikingFan said:
@ greediron said:
i hate idiotic stuff like this In the preseason last year, Sloter completed 41 of 56 passes (73.2
percent) for 366 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions and a
passer rating of 114.1. His numbers were much better than those of
Siemian, who completed 26 of 46 (56.5 percent) for 269 yards with two
touchdowns and one interception and a passer rating of 79.0. Regardless,
Vikings coach Mike Zimmer said at the start of the regular season that
Siemian was the undisputed backup.
How about the qualifier that Sloter went against the scrubs and Siemian went against 1s and 2s for the most part.
I understand what you are saying about just going off of stats and not factoring in who they played against, but I think anyone who watched them play thought that Sloter looked like the much better QB, regardless of the competition they were facing.
Besides, what does Sloter have to do in order to get a fair shake in this competition? Throw for 95%, with 10 TDs and 0 INTs? Because he's done everything asked of him and then some, and for two offseasons in a row, on two different teams, has looked like the best QB on the team during the limited time he's been able to get on the field.
Who says he wasn't given a fair shake? It wasn't really a contest because Sloter was raw and who would go into the season with a raw project as the backup? Everyone knew this, but Tommasson still gets a dig in acting like Zimmer is incompetent and can't see Sloter was that much better.
No offense, but that is a possibility.
No offense, but I think I would take Zimmer/coaches informed opinion over Tomasson/internet opinions any day.
Quote: @greediron said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
@ greediron said:
@ SFVikingFan said:
@ greediron said:
i hate idiotic stuff like this In the preseason last year, Sloter completed 41 of 56 passes (73.2
percent) for 366 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions and a
passer rating of 114.1. His numbers were much better than those of
Siemian, who completed 26 of 46 (56.5 percent) for 269 yards with two
touchdowns and one interception and a passer rating of 79.0. Regardless,
Vikings coach Mike Zimmer said at the start of the regular season that
Siemian was the undisputed backup.
How about the qualifier that Sloter went against the scrubs and Siemian went against 1s and 2s for the most part.
I understand what you are saying about just going off of stats and not factoring in who they played against, but I think anyone who watched them play thought that Sloter looked like the much better QB, regardless of the competition they were facing.
Besides, what does Sloter have to do in order to get a fair shake in this competition? Throw for 95%, with 10 TDs and 0 INTs? Because he's done everything asked of him and then some, and for two offseasons in a row, on two different teams, has looked like the best QB on the team during the limited time he's been able to get on the field.
Who says he wasn't given a fair shake? It wasn't really a contest because Sloter was raw and who would go into the season with a raw project as the backup? Everyone knew this, but Tommasson still gets a dig in acting like Zimmer is incompetent and can't see Sloter was that much better.
No offense, but that is a possibility.
No offense, but I think I would take Zimmer/coaches informed opinion over Tomasson/internet opinions any day.
As would I. Tomasson aside, there is the possibility a coach can be wrong about a player.
Quote: @jargomcfargo said:
@ greediron said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
@ greediron said:
@ SFVikingFan said:
@ greediron said:
i hate idiotic stuff like this In the preseason last year, Sloter completed 41 of 56 passes (73.2
percent) for 366 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions and a
passer rating of 114.1. His numbers were much better than those of
Siemian, who completed 26 of 46 (56.5 percent) for 269 yards with two
touchdowns and one interception and a passer rating of 79.0. Regardless,
Vikings coach Mike Zimmer said at the start of the regular season that
Siemian was the undisputed backup.
How about the qualifier that Sloter went against the scrubs and Siemian went against 1s and 2s for the most part.
I understand what you are saying about just going off of stats and not factoring in who they played against, but I think anyone who watched them play thought that Sloter looked like the much better QB, regardless of the competition they were facing.
Besides, what does Sloter have to do in order to get a fair shake in this competition? Throw for 95%, with 10 TDs and 0 INTs? Because he's done everything asked of him and then some, and for two offseasons in a row, on two different teams, has looked like the best QB on the team during the limited time he's been able to get on the field.
Who says he wasn't given a fair shake? It wasn't really a contest because Sloter was raw and who would go into the season with a raw project as the backup? Everyone knew this, but Tommasson still gets a dig in acting like Zimmer is incompetent and can't see Sloter was that much better.
No offense, but that is a possibility.
No offense, but I think I would take Zimmer/coaches informed opinion over Tomasson/internet opinions any day.
As would I. Tomasson aside, there is the possibility a coach can be wrong about a player.
Yes it is possible. My point was the crappy writing that assumes the writer is smarter than the coach. And seeing the writer, that is very unlikely.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@"BarrNone55" said:
Two years in the same system...if he isn't better than Mannion right now he shouldn't be in the building.
Not really true... the Vikings poached him after final cuts just prior to the start of the 2017 season. He had to learn Shurmur's offense that year without the benefit of OTA's and Training Camp because he was in Denver at the time. Then you factor in that the 3rd QB doesn't get many practice reps during the regular season and he likely didn't have much of a chance to prove himself that first year.
Next thing you know... Shurmur leaves to be a HC and we hire DeFelippo to be our new OC in 2018. He's only had one full offseason with the team and had to learn 3 different offenses in 2 seasons (Denver's, Shurmur's, and DeFlip's). I'm not making excuses for the guy, but let's not pretend like he's had a couple years in the same system because he hasn't.
That's true to a point...I believe Flip retained the terminology that Shurmur used...so, if Shurmur was writing sonnets, and Flip haiku, they were all in English..
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