Joel Klatt on NFLN Total Access re: McCarthy

I think all QB's would want to land with the Vikings. Have a feeling Daniels tonight is like....."$chitt"

Vanguard83 wrote:
I think all QB's would want to land with the Vikings. Have a feeling Daniels tonight is like....."$chitt"

Daniels at least has McLaurin. Drake Maye in NE is supergluing himself to the bench and saying, "No way you're putting me out there coach."

RS_Express wrote:

Daniels at least has McLaurin.  Drake Maye in NE is supergluing himself to the bench and saying, "No way you're putting me out there coach."

Other than maybe Kirk Cousins, Drake Maye was the draft's biggest loser. Heard rumors the GM wanted the trade and the owner wanted the QB. Owner's always going to win that argument....in a dysfunctional franchise.

MaroonBells wrote:

Other than maybe Kirk Cousins, Drake Maye was the draft's biggest loser. Heard rumors the GM wanted the trade and the owner wanted the QB. Owner's always going to win that argument....in a dysfunctional franchise.

Yeah, I heard from a reliable source that the Vikings made a substantial offer for #3 while the Patriots were on the clock and they turned it down.  Leading up to the draft, Kraft flat out said they wanted to leave this draft with a QBotF.  I think this rumor is true, Kraft overruled the FO folks.

That said, it turned out great for the Vikings.  I think they were really high on JJM and got him for much less compensation and were also able to get the best defensive prospect in the draft in Dallas Turner.  Huge win even though we don't have many draft picks left this year or next.

If JJM and Turner pan out as top 10 NFL players to replace Kirk and Danielle, we'll be good for a long time.  With all the cap space next year, we can get whatever we need for depth and have a full compliment of picks in 2026.

I read online that the Vikings offered three 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd and were still rebuffed. That's a massive haul, and sometimes teams just don't want to do business.

MAD GAINZ wrote:

Yeah, I heard from a reliable source that the Vikings made a substantial offer for #3 while the Patriots were on the clock and they turned it down.  Leading up to the draft, Kraft flat out said they wanted to leave this draft with a QBotF.  I think this rumor is true, Kraft overruled the FO folks.

That said, it turned out great for the Vikings.  I think they were really high on JJM and got him for much less compensation and were also able to get the best defensive prospect in the draft in Dallas Turner.  Huge win even though we don't have many draft picks left this year or next.

If JJM and Turner pan out as top 10 NFL players to replace Kirk and Danielle, we'll be good for a long time.  With all the cap space next year, we can get whatever we need for depth and have a full compliment of picks in 2026.

Yeah, I think the calculation was that we'll have $159M in cap space, a QB on a rookie deal and a handful of comp picks. We can afford to overspend a little for QBOTF and the draft's best defensive player.

TheWinterSKOLdier wrote:
I read online that the Vikings offered three 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd and were still rebuffed. That's a massive haul, and sometimes teams just don't want to do business.

I read that too, but where was that 2nd going to come from? We had already burned this year and next years on getting the 23rd pick.

Please, fan base, give the kid (and Darnold, honestly) some time, some patience, and let the new era come in better than the last one went out...!

JimmyinSD wrote:

I read that too, but where was that 2nd going to come from?  We had already burned this year and next years on getting the 23rd pick.

I'm guessing it was 11, 23, our 2025 1st, 2026 2nd, and 2025 3rd.

MaroonBells wrote:

Yeah, I think the calculation was that we'll have $159M in cap space, a QB on a rookie deal and a handful of comp picks. We can afford to overspend a little for QBOTF and the draft's best defensive player.

I think moving up to 17 was a pretty easy argument if you're picking up the #1 EDGE player. They'll pickup a compensatory 3 (or more) to replace that pick. Then you can much more easily maneuver around the draft board if you aren't eyeing up premium positions. So they'll be able to pickup some picks next year I imagine. But the $100M+ in cap room absolutely matters. The Vikings talk about "resources" a lot. You can replace your lack of picks with $.

MAD GAINZ wrote:

I'm guessing it was 11, 23, our 2025 1st, 2026 2nd, and 2025 3rd.

Jeez. And the Pats turned this down?! I really wanted Maye. They must have too. They better hope he fulfills his potential because with some very doable maneuvering on their part they could've turned those picks into 4 firsts across this year and next. To drop 8 spots. And they said no. Wow.

pattersaur wrote:

Jeez. And the Pats turned this down?! I really wanted Maye. They must have too. They better hope he fulfills his potential because with some very doable maneuvering on their part they could've turned those picks into 4 firsts across this year and next. To drop 8 spots. And they said no. Wow.

I wanted Maye more, but really only because I think that's who KOC wanted and I trust his judgement. I was hoping for the big trade up. But over the last couple weeks I began to think of JJM as pretty even with Maye on my wishlist. 

In many ways JJ's a cleaner prospect. He needs development (they all do), but you don't have those problematic footwork issues like you would have with Maye. Then there were the handful of QB experts who continued to rank Maye last among the top 6. I trust KOC's judgement over theirs but it was a little concerning. To give up the farm, you'd like to see more of a consensus on the guy.

Thank you Robert Kraft for saving us from Herschel Walker Part Deux. Go get yourself a strip mall massage, buddy, you've earned it!

MaroonBells wrote:

I wanted Maye more, but really only because I think that's who KOC wanted and I trust his judgement. I was hoping for the big trade up. But over the last couple weeks I began to think of JJM as pretty even with Maye on my wishlist. 

In many ways JJ's a cleaner prospect. He needs development (they all do), but you don't have those problematic footwork issues like you would have with Maye. Then there were the handful of QB experts who continued to rank Maye last among the top 6. I trust KOC's judgement over theirs but it was a little concerning. To give up the farm, you'd like to see more of a consensus on the guy.

Totally agree, MB.  I was hoping for Maye, but despite his upside, he has some downside as well.  All the rookie QBs this year did, whether it was Caleb's questions on hero ball/decision making, to Daniels skinny frame and taking a lot of sacks for a mobile QB, to Maye's footwork and decisionmaking, to McCarthy's projection questions playing in a low volume passing attac), Penix's injury history and weird release, Nix's projection with the offense he played in and questions about his upside, etc.

Given the likelihood that Williams and Daniels were going 1 and 2, it seemed like our best options were to convince the Patriots to trade out of Maye (for a lot of draft capital) or try to get JJM who has a lot of traits, accuracy, leadership, but is more of a projection.  

Honestly, I see a lot of Joe Burrow in JJM.  Same build, mobile, accurate, and Burrow wasn't asked to carry a team until his 5th year at LSU when he exploded.  If JJM stayed in school and transferred to a team that gave him the same opportunities as Burrow, we could have been talking about him as a potential #1 pick next year and we got him at 10 in this draft.

I like how it played out.

BOOM

MAD GAINZ wrote:

BOOM

You gave yourself away there, Wetlander. :-)

Not being able to move up for Maye could be a blessing in disguise.  You need two to tangle, even if you are giving up too much sometimes it is not enough of course.

I head on a show recently, and I'm sure many of you have as well, but the year or two before Chiefs drafted Mahomes the Chiefs brass tried desperately to move up for a one of the QB's but were rebuffed (I think it was said to be Mariota in 2015?) they then picked Marcus Peters.  The following year they didn't have the ammo to move up, so they moved down and drafted Chris Jones at around 39.  Finally in 2017, they made the move up for Mahomes.

So the bottom line is sometimes not being able to move up and get your guy could be a blessing!

For all I know (and now hope) McCarthy ends up being a much better QB than Maye and we didn't have to give up pick 23 plus.  So, if we made the move up for Maye we wouldn't have Dallas Turner either.  What if both McCarthy and Turner turn into studs while Maye flops?  Even if both QB's flop but Turner turns into an All-Pro DE we still benefit.

MaroonBells wrote:

You gave yourself away there, Wetlander. :-)

Lol, I'm not trying to hide.  Just trying something new, like ditching the Canadian tuxedo for a new suit.   You know, keeping it fresh.

Blessing in disguise? Absofreakin' lutely.
I was never sold on Maye. Upside yes, but too many negatives. I never understood why he was considered in the Top Three QBs in this draft.
Assuming we offered that haul to the Patriots, I am sooo glad they rebuffed it.
We're good. We'll pick up a few 4-7 late round camp fodder kids and they will probably try to find the next Ivan Pace in UDFA on Sunday.

I struggle to imagine how anyone could rank an unproven Maye as that much better than JJM or Penix + a dump truck full of picks. Maybe the Pats saved us from ourselves or maybe that haul isn't quite accurate as that would be a lot more than I feel like you'd want to commit to a single prospect.

Not only am I not buying that they offered that kind of draft capital to go to 3, I’m not convinced Maye was their number 1 target. According to a GM for another team, it was known to them the Vikings really wanted JJM. It’s possible they would move up to take him at 3. Unable to do it, they would wait to jump up when the chance presented itself. It’s just me guessing, but I have to wonder if the Giants were a concern. Either way, after they went WR, everything looked golden.

The expectation sticking in their spots: the Vikings were well known to want JJM, the Broncos were all in in Nix and planned to trade down for more picks and take him, and the Raiders wanted Penix badly. One of the three GM’s had even considered having a conference call to be sure no one traded out and f’ed things up. Then Atlanta happened.

Atlanta took Penix and totally messed things up. Once Penix was gone, the Raiders would be left with no one unless they could move up. The Jets scored when ATL took Penix. So the Vikings had to trade up to ensure they could get their guy. Had Penix and Nix been available, the Broncos wanted to trade down. Since they knew the Raiders would take Nix after Oenix was gone, they had to stand pat and take him. If I were to guess, the Broncos had expected to pull a pick from the Raiders to move up one and guarantee they get their guy in Penix.

This is what I’ve heard. Yet again, people are pointing at Atlanta for being dinks. At least one GM believed the Vikings number 1 target was JJM and not Maye. We’ll probably never know, but it brings me back to comments from Harbaugh saying he thought JJM would go much higher than people expected.

Lastly, JJM declined a congratulatory call from Wayne Gretzky last night.