Vikings want to keep 23?

I don't know how any of us can evaluate pre-draft rumors except on the basis of "they are all lies."

But if what you suggest is true, I'd say it's more likely that they can't stomach the price to move up into the top 5 considering what they'd be getting (JJM), and instead plan to take whoever is available at 11, or possibly make a minor move up a few spots to outmaneuver Denver, the only team behind them that I think would legitimately try to move up this year. Either of those scenarios would leave 23 in place.

I read something concerning the possible tampering charge against the Falcons.  Of course can't find it now to post, but its possible it could happen on draft night that the Falcons and Vikings swap picks 8 and 11.  If that happens then the Vikings could keep 23 and still try and use the 8th pick to move up or stay put at 8 and take a quarterback at that spot.

The rumor mill is certainly picking-up steam...

JJM is case in point...As high as a #2 pick discussed a week ago and now what is his "real true worth" to move-up?

As a fan? I would rather give-up 11 and 23 this season to move up to say 5 vs 11 and next years #1 and keep 23 this year.

Hell, next year could be a top 10 pick for all we know.

Thought this was the long awaited Andrew Booth Jr. thread… :cool: :P

I wonder if the Vikings might also be considering trading a player instead of pick 23. Vikings just brought in JC Latham for a visit. Latham is a 1st round RT prospect, which you would think we don't need. Might the Vikings consider trading Brian O'Neill? Latham might also project to guard. Dude's massive at 6-6, 342, but unlike most big guys he has a reputation for zone blocking well.

Greylock wrote:
I read something concerning the possible tampering charge against the Falcons.  Of course can't find it now to post, but its possible it could happen on draft night that the Falcons and Vikings swap picks 8 and 11.  If that happens then the Vikings could keep 23 and still try and use the 8th pick to move up or stay put at 8 and take a quarterback at that spot.

Could a Falcons, Vikings tampering settlement be announced just before round one of the draft?

Probs would take 11, next years #1, 108, and next years #3 to get to #5. Would the chargers pass on OT 1 and OT 2 to do that?

If I’m Harbaugh I would consider it. You could get Fuaga at 11 probably. The Titans at 7 are the best trade partner in my mind, as they need Oline badly. but not sure that gets us JJM. Giants could easily trade out with Denver or Vegas.

I don’t think there is any way we can keep 23 if we are trying to get JJM, Cards are probs the only way to get JJM and I dint see them passing on MHJ.

Bullazin wrote:
Probs would take 11, next years #1, 108, and next years #3 to get to #5.  Would the chargers pass on OT 1 and OT 2 to do that? 

If I’m Harbaugh I would consider it.  You could get Fuaga at 11 probably. The Titans at 7 are the best trade partner in my mind, as they need Oline badly. but not sure that gets us JJM. Giants could easily trade out with Denver or Vegas.

I don’t think there is any way we can keep 23 if we are trying to get JJM, Cards are probs the only way to get JJM and I dint see them passing on MHJ.

Like I said elsewehere, it's not MHJ or nothing for the Cards. It's MHJ vs. Udunze or Thomas and pick 23. Which do you take? Same with the Chargers. There are EIGHT offensive tackles with 1st round grades. So for them it's Alt by himself vs. Fashanu, Fuaga, or Fauntanu and pick 23. I take the 2nd option in both of those.

But agree on 23. I don't see how we keep it unless we're moving outside the top 5.

MaroonBells wrote:

Like I said elsewehere, it's not MHJ or nothing for the Cards. It's MHJ vs. Udunze or Thomas and pick 23. Which do you take? Same with the Chargers. There are EIGHT offensive tackles with 1st round grades. So for them it's Alt by himself vs. Fashanu, Fuaga, or Fauntanu and pick 23. I take the 2nd option in both of those.

But agree on 23. I don't see how we keep it unless we're moving outside the top 5.

We are targeting JJM? Did I miss something? I’d be surprised if that’s the case.

EAGAN, Minn. -- The scenario seems so smooth and obvious.

Eyeing a draft with a deep class of quarterbacks, the Minnesota Vikings part ways with veteran incumbent Kirk Cousins. They sign a $10 million bridge starter in Sam Darnold and then acquire a second first-round pick (No. 23 overall) to pair with their own spot at No. 11, presumably to power a draft-day trade into the top 5. Then they draft their quarterback -- maybe North Carolina's Drake Maye or perhaps Michigan's J.J. McCarthy or even Washington's Michael Penix Jr. -- and move seamlessly into a new era.

Anyone who has been around the NFL, and the Vikings' franchise in particular, knows how rarely the path to a franchise quarterback is smooth and obvious. And so as general manager Kwesi Adofo-Mensah gave his annual pre-draft press conference last week, it was worth asking: Is there a world where you won't (or can't) draft a quarterback?

"You have to be ready for everything," he said. "It's a very deep class. But I do think you have to be ready for every scenario. If there's elite players at premium positions on the board, I don't think you're supposed to reach or force or anything like that. It's just not what I believe, all the while understanding that is the most important position in the sport. So, it's calculating both those things at the same time."

NFL general managers try to be as vague as possible this time of year, but if there is one thing Adofo-Mensah has been clear about, it's that -- despite the team's clear need for a quarterback -- there will be a limit to the amount of resources he's willing to use to draft one.

As he has discussed the strategy involved in potentially moving up from No. 11, Adofo-Mensah has noted the potential for irrational decisions from other teams, stressed the importance of "walkaway prices" and insisted that "your only leverage in the negotiation is your willingness to do something else."

It's certainly possible that Adofo-Mensah is just trying to emphasize in a public way that he won't sell out to draft a quarterback, even if the external view is that he has no choice. But he has already demonstrated his willingness to stand firm on a number this offseason by refusing to offer Cousins more than one fully-guaranteed season, a decision that precipitated Cousins' departure. And there are plenty of roadblocks that could make the task exceptionally difficult.

It's quite possible, if not likely, that the top three teams on the board -- Chicago, Washington and New England -- will each draft a quarterback. And there is the potential for at least three teams other than the Vikings making a play for a quarterback in the top 10. The New York Giants already have the No. 6 pick, while the Denver Broncos at No. 12 and the Las Vegas Raiders at No. 13 are both candidates to trade up. And that list doesn't account for any stealth teams that have kept their plans more private than others.

"You're in a blind auction in a sense," Adofo-Mensah said. "And you don't know when the next person is going to raise their hand and call a name. And so, you've really just got to be strategic about how you position yourself. At the end of the day, you've got to ask yourself, 'Am I going to regret not doing this trade? If that player gets picked this spot, whatever this spot is, and I was willing to give up this? Can I sleep at night?'

"That's how we've got to look at the board in every place. And then we'll come up with our valuations for every player in that way, and we'll make our calls and we'll go from there. And ultimately, if the league is willing to do something that we are not willing to do, we can't let that necessarily dictate our actions."

None of this is to downplay the possibility of the Vikings pulling off a trade, or at least drafting a quarterback at some point in the first round. It remains the likeliest scenario, all things considered, especially when you remember they have no second- or third-round picks.

Adofo-Mensah also said this week that "just because something's risky doesn't mean you have to stay away from it," but that phrase could also apply to passing on a trade.

The reason to establish limits on a trade, Adofo-Mensah has said, is the risk of depleting the ability to build a winning team around it. The Vikings had an aggressive offseason in which they signed 12 veteran free agents, including at least five who are likely to start, in part by using the cap space they saved by not paying Cousins.

"If you look at our offseason, it's kind of the go between, between quarterback assets and everything else," Adofo-Mensah said. "I think our draft will follow the same suit. I don't think you want to necessarily go take these huge swings and not be able to build a team around them."

For that reason, he said, the Vikings have made sure there are "multiple guys that we are in love with just on an outright basis" as well as another tier of quarterbacks they would love because it would require fewer assets to draft them.

"We've got a great plan," Adofo-Mensah said, "and we feel great about where we are."

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39928600/vikings-force-trade-draft-qb

Kiper just released his last mock. Has the Vikings giving up both 1sts, and our 1st in 2025 to move up to 5th for JJ McCarthy. There is just no way I'd even consider giving up next years 1st in a package unless it's to get up into the top 3. These teams think they can screw us because we "need" a QB and Kwesi has made dumb draft day trades in the past. If he gives up three 1st round picks for the 4th rated QB in this draft, somebody better give him an IQ test and recheck his resume.

Kiper also has both Nix and Penix going in the second round.

supafreak84Kiper just released his last mock. Has the Vikings giving up both 1sts, and our 1st in 2025 to move up to 5th for JJ McCarthy. There is just no way I'd even consider giving up next years 1st in a package unless it's to get up into the top 3. These teams think they can screw us because we "need" a QB and Kwesi has made dumb draft day trades in the past. If he gives up three 1st round picks for the 4th rated QB in this draft, somebody better give him an IQ test and recheck his resume.

Kiper also has both Nix and Penix going in the second round.

Kiper is high if he thinks it will take next years first to go up to 5.

kmillard wrote:
supafreak84Kiper just released his last mock. Has the Vikings giving up both 1sts, and our 1st in 2025 to move up to 5th for JJ McCarthy. There is just no way I'd even consider giving up next years 1st in a package unless it's to get up into the top 3. These teams think they can screw us because we "need" a QB and Kwesi has made dumb draft day trades in the past. If he gives up three 1st round picks for the 4th rated QB in this draft, somebody better give him an IQ test and recheck his resume.

Kiper also has both Nix and Penix going in the second round.

Kiper is high if he thinks it will take next years first to go up to 5.

There's a lot of pundits who have us giving up three 1st round picks to move up for McCarthy in some fashion. I think it's because of this narrative that we are "desperate" and teams can take advantage of us. I'm almost like, screw it at this point, if McCarthy lands in our laps at #11, great, otherwise let's take the two best players on the board at #11 and #23 and let's roll behind Sam Darnold. If it doesn't work out we'll be drafting early in 2025 and will still have our pick. Giving up three first round picks, including one that could very likely be an early pick in 2025 is just asinine. Let's not be next years version of the Carolina Pathers

The problem w8th the logic of assuming next years 1st will be a high first if Darnold doesn't work out is that we still have a pretty potent offense, what should be am improved defense, and a couple of backups that could win a few games themselves. We have seen plenty of teams do ok with less than stellar QB play. I think it's more likely that we end up picking in that 10 to 20 range again if Darnold doesn't worn out, but in what's likely to be a much weaker QB draft the option to move into a top 5 spot for one of those QBs would likely be much more costly if even an option at all. I dont want to spend next years one either, especially after trading our 2s, but get your guy this year.

I don't buy for one second that KAM's serious about wanting to keep 23. Maybe it works out that way and we're only able to move up a few spots or even have to stay put, but I think he's begging the top 3/4/5 teams in the draft to take that 23rd pick off our hands. The only question for me is whether or not they will.

I agree with Jimmy and Sticky-- we need the QB THIS year. Waiting another year and having this same conversation about moving up, trading future firsts, and all of us being another year older, is silly. I just can't believe that's this team's plan.

The only way I see us keeping 23 is if we really don't covet any of the 2md 3 over the others, then stay or maybe a slight jump using later round picks, then we'd still have 23

pattersaur wrote:
I don't buy for one second that KAM's serious about wanting to keep 23. Maybe it works out that way and we're only able to move up a few spots or even have to stay put, but I think he's begging the top 3/4/5 teams in the draft to take that 23rd pick off our hands. The only question for me is whether or not they will.

I agree with Jimmy and Sticky-- we need the QB THIS year. Waiting another year and having this same conversation about moving up, trading future firsts, and all of us being another year older, is silly. I just can't believe that's this team's plan.

Oh I think he's serious alright. Just might not be realistic. It sounds like they'd rather give up the '25 1st than pick 23. And of course they would. It's worth far less. Just don't know how you get into the top 5 without it. 

This is why I think this has come about due to conversations the Vikings have been having with teams between 6 and 10. You could feasibly get into that range with next year's 1st instead of this year's pick 23.

MaroonBells wrote:

Oh I think he's serious alright. Just might not be realistic. It sounds like they'd rather give up the '25 1st than pick 23. And of course they would. It's worth far less. Just don't know how you get into the top 5 without it. 

This is why I think this has come about due to conversations the Vikings have been having with teams between 6 and 10. You could feasibly get into that range with next year's 1st instead of this year's pick 23.

IT sounds like Commanders are starting to solidify on Daniels @ 2. 

Maye most likely goes to NE - unless something really crazy happens and some team coughs-up a big bag. 

I think our best chances @ a JJM are 5 - maybe (big maybe) @ 4. I dont see the Giants trading with the Vikings at 6 and there are other teams wanting/willing to move-up. 

Picks 4-10 are dangerous for the Vikings if they dont move up for whoever "Their Guy" is. 

Maybe they are fine with Penix or Nix @ 11. That seems high for either over an elite D talent. OTOH, not getting a QB this year after losing Cousins would cause me to really think about the effectiveness of this front office.

purplefaithful wrote:

IT sounds like Commanders are starting to solidify on Daniels @ 2. 

Maye most likely goes to NE - unless something really crazy happens and some team coughs-up a big bag. 

I think our best chances @ a JJM are 5 - maybe (big maybe) @ 4. I dont see the Giants trading with the Vikings at 6 and there are other teams wanting/willing to move-up. 

Picks 4-10 are dangerous for the Vikings if they dont move up for whoever "Their Guy" is. 

Maybe they are fine with Penix or Nix @ 11. That seems high for either over an elite D talent. OTOH, not getting a QB this year after losing Cousins would cause me to really think about the effectiveness of this front office.

...after not doing what it took to keep Cousins, not doing what it took to move up for the QB last year, not doing what it took to sign Christian Wilkins, Hunter. Hopefully we don't add JJ to that list. 

I like a lot of the hard decisions Kwesi has made in setting this team up for a run in '25, with $159M in cap space and hopefully the QBOTF on a rookie deal. But this seeming refusal to go X+1 to add key pieces could be his downfall.