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RE: Looking back is easy and clear - supafreak84 - 11-29-2025
(11-29-2025, 01:57 PM)Still Hurtn Wrote: I dont think KOC drafted JJM. They tried to trade for Maye but were unsuccessful. The plan for Kwesi was get a QB. JJM became a Viking out of default. When Kwesi said we are trading for Turner KOC looked shocked. This tells me Kwesi makes the picks. He gambled and failed.
I'd have to think, based on everything about KOC, that he'd have to have significant input on the quarterback position as a whole and who he wants on the roster. Thats a rationale assumption. Since he's been here, the backup quarterback position has been completely mismanaged, including the Sam Howell debacle this offseason. We've drafted two quarterbacks and both were/have been awful. So if we have a head coach who can't identify quarterback talent, and we know our GM struggles in identifying any talent, that leaves us up shit creek without a paddle unless changes are made with those making the decisions this offseason.
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - Greylock - 11-29-2025
(11-29-2025, 01:57 PM)Still Hurtn Wrote: I dont think KOC drafted JJM. They tried to trade for Maye but were unsuccessful. The plan for Kwesi was get a QB. JJM became a Viking out of default. When Kwesi said we are trading for Turner KOC looked shocked. This tells me Kwesi makes the picks. He gambled and failed.
KOC did look shocked when Kwesi told him they were going to draft Turner. KOC looked at him and said "Really". Turner was dropping for a reason and Kwesi must not have gotten the memo. So he filled out the card and strutted around the room like he just pulled one over on the rest of the league. Kwesi makes the picks but he gets a lot of input from his good buddy Mr. Grigson, yea the same guy that couldn't pick players when he was with the Colts. But hey we got him!
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - hogjowlsjohnny - 11-29-2025
They were saddled with a competitive rebuild by the owners. They inherited Cousins and were up against the cap a bit. They also had a vision of building a team around a rookie QB with the freedom from cap constraints that would allow them to build a team around that rookie contract. They turned that vision into a plan when they wouldn't pay Cousins more than they thought he was worth. So along comes stop gap QB Darnold who provides a season resulting in a very attractive alternative.
Do they pay Darnold and limit what they can do in free agency or stick to the plan and start the injured red shirt rookie?
Darnold looked terrible the last two games although he was under seige with substandard offensive line play in both. Was that enough to let him go and forge ahead with the original plan? Was annointing JJ without competition their original plan without Jones having a fair shot. Jones knew what Richardson could do and chose to compete against him.
Losing Jones was simply Jones making a wise decision.
Looking back, it would appear the Vikings made the wrong decision.
The book hasn't been finished but this chapter appears they have painted themselves into a corner. It will take some clever maneuvering to turn this into a good ending.
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - MaroonBells - 11-29-2025
(11-29-2025, 02:26 PM)Greylock Wrote: KOC did look shocked when Kwesi told him they were going to draft Turner. KOC looked at him and said "Really". Turner was dropping for a reason and Kwesi must not have gotten the memo. So he filled out the card and strutted around the room like he just pulled one over on the rest of the league. Kwesi makes the picks but he gets a lot of input from his good buddy Mr. Grigson, yea the same guy that couldn't pick players when he was with the Colts. But hey we got him!
Totally agree. Everyone knew Turner was horrible, including me, you and a dog named Boo—but especially KOC when he flashed that bemused expression at the forever-clueless Kwesi Adofo-Mensah and his Grinion. Every NFL team but the Vikings knew Turner was bad, and all that shit about him being the consensus #1 defensive player in the draft was just a joke played on us by the cool teams. But we swallowed it...hook, line, sinker, bobber, and arm up to the elbow.
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - BigAl99 - 11-29-2025
In response to another thread I looked up the QB draft picks KOC was involved with as QB coach, OC or assistant coach, and it wasn't impressive. In Cleveland, Manzeil, SF Driskel and Wash. Haskins . None developed into franchise players or even long term starters. With the Rams he had Stafford. As OC in Washington 2018 he used 4 QBs, Smith, Johnson, McCoy and Sanchez, snake bit year, but no resurrections. Seems the success he has had with the position may have been being in the right place at the right time. I sure don't want to give up on KOC as coach but not sure how good he is at developing young players. Watching the games today I saw Brady Quinn and I just got a chill.
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - supafreak84 - 11-29-2025
(11-29-2025, 07:47 PM)BigAl99 Wrote: In response to another thread I looked up the QB draft picks KOC was involved with as QB coach, OC or assistant coach, and it wasn't impressive. In Cleveland, Manzeil, SF Driskel and Wash. Haskins . None developed into franchise players or even long term starters. With the Rams he had Stafford. As OC in Washington 2018 he used 4 QBs, Smith, Johnson, McCoy and Sanchez, snake bit year, but no resurrections. Seems the success he has had with the position may have been being in the right place at the right time. I sure don't want to give up on KOC as coach but not sure how good he is at developing young players. Watching the games today I saw Brady Quinn and I just got a chill.
Yup so not sure where the "quarterback whisperer" moniker comes from that is so freely passed around in the media because he's NEVER developed a young quarterback as a coach. Any success he's ever had has come with a seasoned veteran quarterback under center, so let's see what he can do with Brosmer. If history is any indication, Sunday will be a very long day
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - Chuckf - 12-01-2025
(11-29-2025, 08:07 PM)supafreak84 Wrote: Yup so not sure where the "quarterback whisperer" moniker comes from that is so freely passed around in the media because he's NEVER developed a young quarterback as a coach. Any success he's ever had has come with a seasoned veteran quarterback under center, so let's see what he can do with Brosmer. If history is any indication, Sunday will be a very long day
History did thus indicate correctly. How did a 14-3 team turn into a dumpster fire?
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - purplefaithful - 12-01-2025
(7 hours ago)Chuckf Wrote: History did thus indicate correctly. How did a 14-3 team turn into a dumpster fire?
I think its incredibly simple....
JJM wasn't nearly cooked enough yet.
The Vikings org is getting skewered in the media and by fans for their decision making/planning this off-season. They had an embarrassment of riches in that QB room last year.
We can only hope ownership makes the right calls going forward.
Where will the BUC STOP???
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - greediron - 12-01-2025
(11-29-2025, 12:27 PM)MaroonBells Wrote: Vikings made a handful of mistakes in the offseason that come to my mind. Thinking Sam Howell could be a capable QB2 and trading Mekhi Blackmon for a half-eaten box of Lemonheads. Those were head scratchers to me. But I think the decision to upgrade Bradbury with Kelly was a good one. I think the decision to upgrade Risner with Fries was a good one. I think upgrading Bullard and Tillery with Allen and Hargrave was a good one. I think drafting Donovan Jackson was a good one. Have they all been successful? Of course not. But they never are. Why are the Vikings 4-7? It has very little to do with the above. It's because JJ McCarthy isn't ready. Should the Vikings have waited to see what they had in JJ before investing so much in his surround? Maybe. But people on this board have been arguing the opposite for years.
I saw someone bitching about Danielle Hunter earlier. That's rich. A year ago that decision looked brilliant. Genius even. Greenard was better AND cheaper. That decision doesn't look as good as it did just 6 months ago. But to those incapable of critical thought, the reality of the moment defines what is, what has been and what always will be. It's exhausting and idiotic.
It was an all in. If JJ played adequate football and started to figure it out by December, we would have been in a great position. QB on rookie contract, make some noise in the playoffs and next year have a chance at the super bowl.
RE: Looking back is easy and clear - pattersaur - 12-01-2025
(6 hours ago)greediron Wrote: It is an all in. If JJ plays adequate football and starts to figure it out by December, we are in a great position. QB on rookie contract, make some noise in the playoffs and next year have a chance at the super bowl.
Playoffs? PLAYOFFS?! We can't even win a game